freenode #wikipedia

2008-05-19 04:52 < nixeagle> if its on a policy/guideline page, then it has to reach agreement, which goes back to what I just said...
2008-05-19 04:52 < The359> links on policy pages though are usually just about discussing the subject
2008-05-19 04:52 < The359> Not for pointing people to services where they can do what we don't allow on Wikipedia
2008-05-19 04:53 < nixeagle> The359: exactly :P
2008-05-19 04:53 < The359> it'd be like WP:CENSORED linking to NetNanny
2008-05-19 04:53 < nixeagle> if its a service, its spam. I'll personally remove it if you like
2008-05-19 04:53 < nixeagle> they do it again, I'm glad to block them >.>
2008-05-19 04:53 < amidaniel> whee
2008-05-19 04:53 < nixeagle> \o/ netsplits :D
2008-05-19 04:53 * amidaniel loves netsplits
2008-05-19 04:54 < Shiroi_Neko> hello AdamBishop
2008-05-19 04:54 * amidaniel wonders why he's never on the server that splits O.o
2008-05-19 04:54 < nixeagle> amidaniel: they are especially fun in large channels like #ubuntu ;)
2008-05-19 04:54 < amidaniel> Meh, irssi hides them all from me :(
2008-05-19 04:54 < Shiroi_Neko> ubuntu is comunism
2008-05-19 04:54 < nixeagle> amidaniel: hah true :P
2008-05-19 04:54 < nixeagle> Shiroi_Neko: O.o back up your assetion please.
2008-05-19 04:54 < Shiroi_Neko> ubuntu is not seeking profit
2008-05-19 04:55 < Shiroi_Neko> must be communism
2008-05-19 04:55 < amidaniel> Shiroi_Neko: Hmmm .. corporate sponsored comunism [sic]
2008-05-19 04:55 < Shiroi_Neko> amidaniel like china :D
2008-05-19 04:55 < nixeagle> Shiroi_Neko: err...
2008-05-19 04:55 < nixeagle> Shiroi_Neko: know who sponsers ubuntu right?
2008-05-19 04:55 < amidaniel> China has a corporate sponsor :S
2008-05-19 04:55 < nixeagle> Canonical?
2008-05-19 04:55 < WBOSITG> allo
2008-05-19 04:55 < Shiroi_Neko> I dont know anything about ubuntu
2008-05-19 04:55 < The359> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loma_Prieta_earthquake What's with all the images on this article?
2008-05-19 04:55 < nixeagle> And that canonical gets profit based on paid support.
2008-05-19 04:55 < Shiroi_Neko> I am not into pokemon
2008-05-19 04:55 < nixeagle> Shiroi_Neko: then don't say stupid statements like that.
2008-05-19 04:55 < amidaniel> Shiroi_Neko: :|
2008-05-19 04:56 * amidaniel baninates Shiroi_Neko
2008-05-19 04:56 < The359> The thumbnails feature a "Photo by C.E. Meyer, USGS" subcaption
2008-05-19 04:56 < k_wifler> horray for citing sources of opinions
2008-05-19 04:56 < Shiroi_Neko> The359 thats bad
2008-05-19 04:56 < Shiroi_Neko> remove it at once
2008-05-19 04:56 < The359> they're all public domain pictures because they're USGS
2008-05-19 04:57 < Shiroi_Neko> The359 probably yes
2008-05-19 04:57 < Shiroi_Neko> unless stated otherwise
2008-05-19 04:57 < k_wifler> images make people wonder what all the texty stuff is about
2008-05-19 04:57 < amidaniel> Fags will rot in hell.<ref>'''The Bible'''.</ref>
2008-05-19 04:57 < Shiroi_Neko> is there a (c) ?
2008-05-19 04:57 < The359> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:LomaPrieta-SOMA.jpeg
2008-05-19 04:57 < The359> hmmm
2008-05-19 04:58 < The359> nevermind
2008-05-19 04:58 < The359> Permission
2008-05-19 04:58 < The359> (Reusing this image)
2008-05-19 04:58 < The359> "Feel free to use any of these images but please cite the photographer and the U.S. Geological Survey."
2008-05-19 04:58 * Shiroi_Neko minds nevermore forevermore
2008-05-19 04:58 < The359> although, technically, don't we just have to cite the photographer on the image page?
2008-05-19 04:58 < nixeagle> This image is in the public domain because it contains materials that originally came from th <.<
2008-05-19 04:58 < The359> Not on the article itself?
2008-05-19 04:58 < Shiroi_Neko> The359 yes
2008-05-19 04:58 < nixeagle> The359: yea
2008-05-19 04:58 < AdamBishop> I think Super Mario Galaxy is giving me a rotator cuff injury
2008-05-19 04:58 < Shiroi_Neko> thats al the citation we do
2008-05-19 04:58 < nixeagle> plus the image is public domain
2008-05-19 04:58 < Shiroi_Neko> GFDL requires credit as well
2008-05-19 04:58 < k_wifler> The395: you solve your own problems? wow, you should be a wikipedia IRC channel helper
2008-05-19 04:59 < Shiroi_Neko> nixeagle not all works by US federal agencies are PD
2008-05-19 04:59 < nixeagle> Shiroi_Neko: yes yes I know :)
2008-05-19 04:59 < Shiroi_Neko> some contracts such as the ones with ESA require credit
2008-05-19 04:59 < nixeagle> but that one is :P
2008-05-19 04:59 < The359> I'm trying to see if I can find who added the captions
2008-05-19 04:59 < Shiroi_Neko> You also need to belly dance for a minute per each commercial use
2008-05-19 05:00 < k_wifler> with all of the horrible responses I'm getting about my question, I am afraid to post it to the talk page
2008-05-19 05:00 < The359> horrible responses?
2008-05-19 05:00 < Shiroi_Neko> k_wifler dont be afraid
2008-05-19 05:00 < The359> We told you it was a bad idea
2008-05-19 05:00 < nixeagle> k_wifler: what was your original question? About linking to where you can do something not allowed in a policy?
2008-05-19 05:01 < k_wifler> not as a loophole, just as an alternate, like when people tell you to use the restroom and not their roses
2008-05-19 05:01 < nixeagle> That means we are promoting said service, wikipedia does not promote anything.
2008-05-19 05:01 < The359> we're not here to provide people with other services, k_wifler
2008-05-19 05:01 < amidaniel> nixeagle: Free knowledge? :)
2008-05-19 05:01 < nixeagle> damn amidaniel you beat me to correcting myself :<
2008-05-19 05:02 < k_wifler> after that I thought of linking to a wikipedia page to such
2008-05-19 05:02 < amidaniel> Uh-huh, sure
2008-05-19 05:02 < nixeagle> hah :P
2008-05-19 05:02 < AdamBishop> what was your question?
2008-05-19 05:02 < nixeagle> k_wifler: even linking to a wikpedia page is bad, we would still be promoting service X Y and Z
2008-05-19 05:02 * Shiroi_Neko violently licks AdamBishop
2008-05-19 05:03 < k_wifler> isn't a wikipedia page about a service pretty much promoting then?
2008-05-19 05:03 < k_wifler> and disambiguations
2008-05-19 05:03 < nixeagle> k_wifler: no, we don't say on our page, "we don't allow x, instead use Y"
2008-05-19 05:03 < nixeagle> k_wifler: if a wikipedia page exists only to promote something, its spam
2008-05-19 05:03 < The359> no, k_wifler
2008-05-19 05:04 < nixeagle> I'll be glad to delete it for that (I think thats G11 if I have my jargon right... tad rusty here)
2008-05-19 05:04 < k_wifler> but linking to a page about publishing research wouldn't be promoting any service
2008-05-19 05:05 < nixeagle> k_wifler: if its a page that says "research is published in journals, find one for your subject area", you can say that in the policy I'd say
2008-05-19 05:07 * JessicaTaylor is away: Eating :D
2008-05-19 05:07 < nixeagle> JessicaTaylor: we don't care that you are away, please disable that
2008-05-19 05:08 < JessicaTaylor> nixeagle: woops
2008-05-19 05:08 < nixeagle> Thanks :P
2008-05-19 05:08 < Dcoetzee> :-/ I don't see a problem with that.
2008-05-19 05:08 < nixeagle> Dcoetzee: how about we all do that when we go away for something
2008-05-19 05:08 < nixeagle> all... 200 of us
2008-05-19 05:09 < Dcoetzee> Sure why not? It helps to know when an active person can no longer be expected to be active.
2008-05-19 05:09 < Dcoetzee> Although in this case the user wasn't active at the time.
2008-05-19 05:09 < nixeagle> There is a reason /away exists, your client will make folks that do /away no longer here
2008-05-19 05:09 < nixeagle> ie they usually grey their name out.
2008-05-19 05:09 < nixeagle> Dcoetzee: and yes if I were in active discussion and I had to leave, I'd let folks here know I was leaving.
2008-05-19 05:10 < nixeagle> Thats... common sense, so folks know that continuing the conversation with me won't get an answer in reply :<
2008-05-19 05:11 < k_wifler> in other words, you care that someone silently and discretely go away to eat
2008-05-19 05:11 < The359> or it's a chat room and 1 person said 1 line saying they're away
2008-05-19 05:11 < The359> Does it kill you that badly?
2008-05-19 05:11 < The359> watch out for the people in here who play music all day...
2008-05-19 05:11 < nixeagle> The359: its bad decorum. If everyone did the same we would have issues :)
2008-05-19 05:11 < The359> it's silly to think everyone would do it at the same time
2008-05-19 05:11 < The359> Let alone that everyone necessarily feels the urge to do it
2008-05-19 05:12 < nixeagle> The359: oh I've seen it :)
2008-05-19 05:12 < The359> Whining is bad decorum as well, I'm sure ;)
2008-05-19 05:12 < nixeagle> usually those sorts of things are scripts.
2008-05-19 05:12 < The359> yes, I know
2008-05-19 05:13 < k_wifler> to be honest, I didn't even notice there were more than.... 4 or so people here
2008-05-19 05:14 < k_wifler> until now
2008-05-19 05:14 < nixeagle> k_wifler: regardless, he fixed it :).
2008-05-19 05:15 < The359> He?
2008-05-19 05:15 < k_wifler> sorry, I will probably never see the page I just added a talk question about, oh well.
2008-05-19 05:15 < WBOSITG> hello again
2008-05-19 05:15 < k_wifler> lol The359 you tickle my sense of humor
2008-05-19 05:16 < nixeagle> k_wifler: check your contribs
2008-05-19 05:16 < k_wifler> thanks for the input everyone who input, bye
2008-05-19 05:16 < nixeagle> The359: err oops, politically correct would be they. :< I hate that we don't have a geneder nuetral word
2008-05-19 05:16 < The359> I just meant, were you talking about JessicaTaylor?
2008-05-19 05:17 < The359> because I think that one doesn't exactly need a gender neutral word
2008-05-19 05:17 < nixeagle> mmm yea I suppose that would be a she based on the name. /me is not awake :<
2008-05-19 05:17 < nsh> http://www.mdolla.com/2008/05/30-mins-before-2008-sichuan-earthquake.html earthquake clouds over sichua
2008-05-19 05:17 < nixeagle> *gets a cafinated drink*
2008-05-19 05:17 < nixeagle> mmm
2008-05-19 05:18 < The359> Blame it on the Chinese seeding the clouds for the Olympics
2008-05-19 05:18 < nixeagle> whoa, nsh thats... odd
2008-05-19 05:18 < nsh> yeah..
2008-05-19 05:19 < nsh> http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2006/06/060619-rainbow-fire.html nice picture of the same (or closely related) meteological phenomenon
2008-05-19 05:20 < nixeagle> oh cool :P now I know what that is ;)
2008-05-19 05:20 < nixeagle> nationalgeographic > blog :P
2008-05-19 05:21 * Mike_H NP: Leona Lewis - Bleeding Love (2007)
2008-05-19 05:21 < Mike_H> love her.
2008-05-19 05:22 * nixeagle is listening to silence - /dev/zero > /dev/null
2008-05-19 05:22 < nixeagle> >.>
2008-05-19 05:22 < nsh> this is also beautiful: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/27/Perlemorskyer_Polar_stratospheric_cloud.jpg
2008-05-19 05:22 < nixeagle> ooh
2008-05-19 05:22 < nsh> can only imagine what it'd have been like in situ
2008-05-19 05:22 < nixeagle> whoa cool, where is the actual image page?
2008-05-19 05:23 * Mike_H dances with nsh to the Leona tune
2008-05-19 05:23 < nsh> from this article: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polar_stratospheric_cloud
2008-05-19 05:23 * nsh enjoys twirling, twirling, twirling with Mike_H
2008-05-19 05:23 < Mike_H> :FD
2008-05-19 05:23 < Mike_H> :D
2008-05-19 05:23 < Mike_H> bah
2008-05-19 05:24 < nsh> hehe
2008-05-19 05:24 < nsh> lulz: http://blog.wired.com/geekdad/2008/03/and-always-twir.html
2008-05-19 05:25 < nsh> the elephant touch is inspired
2008-05-19 05:25 < nsh> man, kids were easy to amuse in the thirties
2008-05-19 05:28 < bumm13> um, that's probably the early 60s
2008-05-19 05:28 < bumm13> (but yeah, that thing clearly was a dud)
2008-05-19 05:32 < Dcoetzee> Hrm, I feel like I should know that song (Mike_H) but I'm not sure.
2008-05-19 05:45 < nsh> http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2005/feb/06/usa.aids US government threatens to withdraw funding from UN aids-prevention program if they continue providing clean needles for IV drug users
2008-05-19 05:46 < nsh> mm, pretty old news. must have missed it the first time around
2008-05-19 05:47 < The359> you made it sound for a second like they wanted them to use dirty needles, nsh
2008-05-19 05:47 < nsh> implicitely, yes.
2008-05-19 05:47 < nsh> just like catholics want teenages to have unwanted pregnancies and catch STIs
2008-05-19 05:47 < nsh> rather than use condoms
2008-05-19 05:48 < nsh> exhortations to abstinence have a rather poor track record at preventing disease and reproduction
2008-05-19 05:49 < nsh> whereas medical hygiene and prophylactics are reasonably realiable
2008-05-19 05:49 < bumm13> just look at the U.S. teen pregnancy rate, 'nuff said
2008-05-19 05:49 < bumm13> "moralizing" health issues is extremely annoying
2008-05-19 05:50 < Dcoetzee> It's inevitable. The body inevitably plays into moral and spiritual significance.
2008-05-19 05:50 < Dcoetzee> I think the key is to get people to avoid adopting viewpoints that contradict public health common sense.
2008-05-19 05:51 < nsh> you say inevitable
2008-05-19 05:51 < nsh> but there is always a memetic vector
2008-05-19 05:51 < nsh> people rarely get ideas about bodily sin from the anterior sky
2008-05-19 05:52 < Dcoetzee> It's inevitable in the sense that religions invariably draw inspiration from everyday experience and the social interactions that impact local societies.
2008-05-19 05:52 * nsh checks pizza
2008-05-19 05:52 < Dcoetzee> I'm not saying all religions would necessarily have a concept of sexual sin. But that they're bound to involve the body and sex in some manner.
2008-05-19 05:52 < bumm13> it's Christian religious bodies that associate such actions with "right for others to be judgemental about said actions"
2008-05-19 05:53 < bumm13> (whether one calls it sin or not)
2008-05-19 05:53 < Dcoetzee> I don't know. Christianity is fairly interferist, but some denominations actively discourage social judgement and proselytizing.
2008-05-19 05:54 < Dcoetzee> If they all did that, it wouldn't be so annoying. :-P
2008-05-19 05:54 < bumm13> wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!
2008-05-19 05:54 < Dcoetzee> Then at least you could write up the judgements to the faults of individuals.
2008-05-19 06:52 * TheRtHonWeasel reads a populist anti-judiciary rant that makes him weary
2008-05-19 07:01 < TheRtHonWeasel> "oh, they're so fancy that they think the will of the people isn't better than some lame constitution."
2008-05-19 07:11 < TheRtHonWeasel> or rather
2008-05-19 07:11 < TheRtHonWeasel> "oh, they're so fancy that they think a constitutional court is qualified to comment on the constitution"
2008-05-19 07:13 < Lycurgus> ur not the weasel in germany are u?
2008-05-19 07:13 < TheRtHonWeasel> I am.
2008-05-19 07:15 < TheRtHonWeasel> Nor Wai!
2008-05-19 07:19 < Lycurgus> in England there's just the will of the people and the pleasure of the crown, it's called a constitutional monarchy but it's really and formally a system with that connects the will of the people with the authority of the crown
2008-05-19 07:20 < Lycurgus> there's nothing correponding to the US constitution there
2008-05-19 07:20 < TheRtHonWeasel> Except that they don't have a constitution that overrides a referendum on any subject the government pleases.
2008-05-19 07:20 < TheRtHonWeasel> Not so in the US (or even Germany)
2008-05-19 07:21 < TheRtHonWeasel> the will of the people can be applied to subjects it mustn't be applied to constitutionally
2008-05-19 07:21 < TheRtHonWeasel> and to point that out isn't "elitist".
2008-05-19 07:21 < TheRtHonWeasel> so those things piss me off.
2008-05-19 07:22 < TheRtHonWeasel> and it's only the start, words like "tyranny", "unelected" and such follow
2008-05-19 07:22 < Lycurgus> i have to admit you've lost me
2008-05-19 07:23 < TheRtHonWeasel> hm... it's about the California law to call gay partnerships "marriage"
2008-05-19 07:23 < TheRtHonWeasel> I think.
2008-05-19 07:23 < TheRtHonWeasel> Wait no
2008-05-19 07:24 < TheRtHonWeasel> it's about whether voters may make a difference in terms between marriages that are essentially alike
2008-05-19 07:24 < TheRtHonWeasel> I guess
2008-05-19 07:24 < TheRtHonWeasel> whether that's discriminatory
2008-05-19 07:25 < Lycurgus> is there a difference between marriange and civil union in germany?
2008-05-19 07:25 < TheRtHonWeasel> I just said that those commentators are the same people who would have resisted the "tyranny" of school segregation in the 1960s because there was a majority opposing it.
2008-05-19 07:25 < Lycurgus> (there isn't in the netherlands)
2008-05-19 07:25 < TheRtHonWeasel> Yea, some.
2008-05-19 07:26 < TheRtHonWeasel> *desegregation
2008-05-19 07:26 < Lycurgus> and there shouldn't be here, but there is and that's why the juridical action was required
2008-05-19 07:26 < TheRtHonWeasel> yup.
2008-05-19 07:26 < TheRtHonWeasel> as I said, the constitution sets a border for valid referenda.
2008-05-19 07:27 < TheRtHonWeasel> And to point that out isn't "elitism that ignores the will of the people"
2008-05-19 07:27 < TheRtHonWeasel> tyrannical elitism no less.
2008-05-19 07:28 < TheRtHonWeasel> I just dislike demagogic and uninformed judiciary-bashing
2008-05-19 07:28 < Lycurgus> in the US there is a hard core roughly 30% of people who are extremely ignorant and backward reactionaries
2008-05-19 07:28 < TheRtHonWeasel> Many of them get into journalism via blogs I'm afraid.
2008-05-19 07:28 < Lycurgus> the best thing is to just acknowledge this and move on since they're not a majority and their day has passed
2008-05-19 07:28 < TheRtHonWeasel> I do believe that too.
2008-05-19 07:29 < Aqwis> lieberal propaganda!
2008-05-19 07:29 < TheRtHonWeasel> the zenith that threatened to be passed even before 2001 is well behind us now.
2008-05-19 07:29 < TheRtHonWeasel> but populism is still alive and well
2008-05-19 07:31 < TheRtHonWeasel> and if lynching blacks is cool for a majority in Mississippi, populists are all for it.
2008-05-19 07:31 < Lycurgus> in europe there seem to be a similar number but the difference is that it doesn't extent to the majority culture as it does it here.
2008-05-19 07:31 < Lycurgus> yeah a lot of your views of american society are distorted
2008-05-19 07:32 < TheRtHonWeasel> I think there are far fewer. the right wing strain popular in Europe just hates Arabs and welfare.
2008-05-19 07:32 < TheRtHonWeasel> (the right-wing liberals in the Netherlands, loads of columnists...)
2008-05-19 07:33 < TheRtHonWeasel> I read lots of lib
2008-05-19 07:33 < TheRtHonWeasel> 'rul blogs that deal with US politics, and populism is definitely a positive term for them
2008-05-19 07:33 < bumm13> hiya Weasel
2008-05-19 07:33 < TheRtHonWeasel> hey
2008-05-19 07:33 < TheRtHonWeasel> the right in Europe is humorless and fierce.
2008-05-19 07:34 < TheRtHonWeasel> but certainly intellectual
2008-05-19 07:34 < TheRtHonWeasel> (I don't consider most Christian Democrats very right-wing)
2008-05-19 07:34 < Lycurgus> yeah the so-called intellectual right in the US still come off as stupey to me
2008-05-19 07:34 < TheRtHonWeasel> I do mean the people that crop up on the WSJ editorials
2008-05-19 07:35 < Lycurgus> the late bill buckely for example
2008-05-19 07:35 < Lycurgus> or karl rove
2008-05-19 07:37 < TheRtHonWeasel> I was thinking Andrew Sullivan/Leon de Winter/other people like that who say everyone to the left of Maggie Thatcher isn't taking life seriously enough
2008-05-19 07:38 < TheRtHonWeasel> prophesying the demise of the Western world from within and all that
2008-05-19 07:38 < TheRtHonWeasel> (hint: it hasn't yet)
2008-05-19 07:39 < Lycurgus> it's all so tediously 20th century isn't it? bbiab
2008-05-19 07:39 < TheRtHonWeasel> heh yea...
2008-05-19 07:57 * Gohan-no-Neko waves
2008-05-19 07:57 < Gohan-no-Neko> does anyone here know how to add intermediate frames to an animation?
2008-05-19 07:57 * TheRtHonWeasel reads this year's SCOTUS decisions
2008-05-19 08:05 < TheRtHonWeasel> Out for lunch.
2008-05-19 08:38 < nsh> TheRtHonWeasel: you feeling too good about humanity or something?
2008-05-19 08:39 < Working_Cat> nsh: ssh
2008-05-19 08:39 < TheRtHonWeasel> Back.
2008-05-19 08:39 < TheRtHonWeasel> Me?
2008-05-19 08:39 < TheRtHonWeasel> Yea.
2008-05-19 08:40 < TheRtHonWeasel> or so say the conservative columnists.
2008-05-19 08:41 < Dolpins> They let out piercing Conservative alarm crys.
2008-05-19 08:43 < TheRtHonWeasel> I'm just insufficiently worried.
2008-05-19 08:49 < nsh> reading scotus decisions should help that
2008-05-19 08:52 < Messedrocker> why scotus
2008-05-19 08:52 < Messedrocker> oh
2008-05-19 08:52 < Messedrocker> INSUFFICIENTLY
2008-05-19 09:36 < kim_> hello
2008-05-19 09:36 < kim_> are there any americans in... I've got one data point so far... basically, how much does gas cost at your local pump, and how many miles per gallon do you get?
2008-05-19 09:37 * kim_ is doing comparisons for fun :-)
2008-05-19 09:37 < Messedrocker> about $3.75, and i am assuming over 20mpg
2008-05-19 09:37 < bbot> kim_: $3.86, no car
2008-05-19 09:37 < bbot> http://www.seattlegasprices.com/mediaideas.aspx
2008-05-19 09:37 < Messedrocker> 18.75 cents per mile!
2008-05-19 09:39 < kim_> let me convert to km per euro
2008-05-19 09:39 < kim_> :-)
2008-05-19 09:39 < cimon> kim_: you Bruning?
2008-05-19 09:41 < kim_> cimon: yes
2008-05-19 09:42 < kim_> Messedrocker: 13.4 out of Eur 1 (is you) ... on the middle range car here, it's 11.5
2008-05-19 09:42 < kim_> Messedrocker: the price disparity is still not extremely high
2008-05-19 09:42 < cimon> kim_: did you have an idea before hand, that Florence was not going to run?
2008-05-19 09:43 < kim_> This other dude had a truck that did 11.3
2008-05-19 09:43 < kim_> cimon, I didn't know she wasn't. But with 20/20 hindsight perhaps I could have known
2008-05-19 09:44 < Messedrocker> yeah, anthere is not quite willing to drink down the kool aid
2008-05-19 09:44 < kim_> Messedrocker, what do you mean?
2008-05-19 09:44 < cimon> kim_: completely on an unrelated note, do you have an idea how the chapter seats will be selected...
2008-05-19 09:44 < kim_> cimon, no clue
2008-05-19 09:44 < Messedrocker> she's friendly with danny. that should be an obv sign
2008-05-19 09:44 < kim_> Messedrocker, she's in charge, yet friendly with her nemesis?
2008-05-19 09:44 < kim_> that's not good...
2008-05-19 09:46 < cimon> kim_: I have yet to figure who danny is in support of.
2008-05-19 09:46 < kim_> cimon, please tell me danny isn't running
2008-05-19 09:46 < cimon> danny isn't running
2008-05-19 09:46 < cimon> there, said it. Have no idea if it is true though;)
2008-05-19 09:47 < Shiroi_Neko> Danny is running
2008-05-19 09:47 < cimon> if he did, that would be... <words fail me>
2008-05-19 09:47 < Shiroi_Neko> but in the local park
2008-05-19 09:48 < Shiroi_Neko> he is an olympic runner
2008-05-19 09:48 < Shiroi_Neko> :P
2008-05-19 09:48 < Shiroi_Neko> he was last see running with an olympic torch
2008-05-19 09:50 < cimon> Personally I haven't yet made my mind up, who to vote for as my number one choice. There is no one there yet that I would feel comfortable personally and publically supporting.
2008-05-19 09:51 < cimon> The condorcet voting system does also throw a wrench into things.
2008-05-19 09:51 < cimon> on the positive side, it should marginalize genuine protest votes, and discourage them in the future...
2008-05-19 09:52 < quanticle> kim_: Gas here costs $3.69 and I get approximately 35-37 mpg.
2008-05-19 09:52 < Shiroi_Neko> cimon endorse obama
2008-05-19 09:52 < quanticle> This is in Minnesota, by the way.
2008-05-19 09:52 < cimon> quanticle: your governor has a cool basement...
2008-05-19 09:52 < Shiroi_Neko> quanticle its three times that over here
2008-05-19 09:52 < Shiroi_Neko> be happy
2008-05-19 09:52 < kim_> urk I just tossed my calculations
2008-05-19 09:53 < Shiroi_Neko> kim_ is a calc tosser
2008-05-19 09:53 < quanticle> cimon: Pawlenty?
2008-05-19 09:53 < kim_> quanticle, you're much cheaper off than .eu at any rate :-)
2008-05-19 09:53 * Cream looks for a admin
2008-05-19 09:53 < kim_> quanticle, compact car?
2008-05-19 09:53 < kim_> !admin
2008-05-19 09:53 < cimon> quanticle: the official governors residence has a table top ice hockey game in the basement...
2008-05-19 09:54 < GDonato> kim_: ?
2008-05-19 09:54 < quanticle> kim_: Yep. I drive a Hyundai Elantra.
2008-05-19 09:54 < kim_> .me points GDonato at Cream
2008-05-19 09:54 * kim_ points GDonato at Cream
2008-05-19 09:54 * Cream says: nevermind, found one
2008-05-19 09:54 < kim_> quanticle, in .us, if you drive an asian or european car, you actually are still better off than europeans
2008-05-19 09:55 < quanticle> kim_: Oh, really? Why's that?
2008-05-19 09:55 < kim_> quanticle, The thing I discovered (with 3 data points), is that everyone tends to run their vehicles at roughly the same price
2008-05-19 09:55 < kim_> quanticle, because it's cheaper ;-)
2008-05-19 09:55 < nsh> the thing i discovered with three data points
2008-05-19 09:56 < nsh> is that the plural of anecdote is not evidence :-)
2008-05-19 09:56 < kim_> nsh, is that statistics sucks :-P
2008-05-19 09:56 < kim_> ROTFL
2008-05-19 09:56 < kim_> totally
2008-05-19 09:56 < kim_> and I don't have a standard deviation for you either :-P
2008-05-19 09:56 < cimon> Shiroi_Neko: Remind me, which one of the candidates running for the board of trustees is Obama? I have a hard time keeping their real names and usernames connected...
2008-05-19 09:56 < quanticle> kim_: Heh. That is true. The demand curve for gas here is remarkably inelastic. I mean, growth in gasoline consumption has only now begun to level off after a nearly 400% increase in price.
2008-05-19 09:56 * nsh just sat through a seminar on genome wide association significances and p-values of 10**-7
2008-05-19 09:56 < Shiroi_Neko> cimon obama hasnt declared his candidacy yet
2008-05-19 09:57 < Shiroi_Neko> that'll take abother 2 years
2008-05-19 09:57 < nsh> lots of potentially interesting genetics and all i could think of is: god i hate statistics
2008-05-19 09:57 < kim_> cimon, there's a dude running for president of the united states called obama :-P
2008-05-19 09:57 < Shiroi_Neko> kim_ I thought obama ws a girl
2008-05-19 09:57 < quanticle> kim_: Everyone here knows that the presidency isn't nearly as significant to our daily life as the Wikipedia board.
2008-05-19 09:57 < cimon> kim_: Dog catcher compared to a seat on the board of the WMF.
2008-05-19 09:57 < cimon> quanticle: gmta
2008-05-19 09:58 < Shiroi_Neko> quanticle but if he seated on both
2008-05-19 09:58 < Shiroi_Neko> he could make US gov donate us entire countries
2008-05-19 09:58 < Shiroi_Neko> and he would liberate countries whoes copyright gets it our way
2008-05-19 09:58 < Shiroi_Neko> CIA would bag vandals >:D
2008-05-19 09:58 < kim_> quanticle, LOL
2008-05-19 09:58 < nsh> we're the one whose copyrights are getting in the way
2008-05-19 09:59 < cimon> Shiroi_Neko: bah, WMF should just invade Molossia on its own.
2008-05-19 09:59 < nsh> and the rest of the world is doing pretty good at ignoring them already
2008-05-19 09:59 * Shiroi_Neko bombs nsh's country
2008-05-19 09:59 < quanticle> Shiroi_Neko: Either that or he'd have the FBI go after people uploading fair-use images.
2008-05-19 09:59 < cimon> [[Molossia]]
2008-05-19 09:59 < kim_> couldn't we just like, set up shop in finland or so?
2008-05-19 09:59 < Shiroi_Neko> obama supports fair-use
2008-05-19 09:59 < Shiroi_Neko> kim_ we could
2008-05-19 09:59 < Shiroi_Neko> or if US donated an air craft carrier
2008-05-19 09:59 < Shiroi_Neko> perhaps international waters
2008-05-19 10:00 < kim_> Shiroi_Neko, like in snow crash? :-)
2008-05-19 10:00 < quanticle> Shiroi_Neko: Not to mention the fact that Uncyclopedia and ED would be bombed into oblivion. Either that or they would take over other countries as a defense mechanism and together we'd all launch World War 3.
2008-05-19 10:00 < cimon> kim_: problem with finland is we have only citation rights, no fair use. And we have this uncomfortable thing called moral rights, which are inalienable.
2008-05-19 10:00 < Shiroi_Neko> kim_ board meetings would be heald on the aircraft carrier
2008-05-19 10:00 < Shiroi_Neko> and board members would arive in fighter jets
2008-05-19 10:01 < quanticle> Shiroi_Neko: But would the unveil "Mission Accomplished" banners?
2008-05-19 10:01 < Shiroi_Neko> quanticle no
2008-05-19 10:01 < Shiroi_Neko> Mission reverted banner
2008-05-19 10:02 < Shiroi_Neko> Ship should be named the WFS Enterprise
2008-05-19 10:02 < cimon> kim_: basically PD does not exist in finland, the best our constitution allows is CC-BY (with permission)...
2008-05-19 10:02 < Shiroi_Neko> cimon finland has morals?
2008-05-19 10:02 < quanticle> "Today we captured the famous troll [[User:Osama bin Laden]] and put him on indef. ban."
2008-05-19 10:03 < kim_> cimon, that sounds ok
2008-05-19 10:03 < Shiroi_Neko> Osama bin Laden is a POINT violator
2008-05-19 10:03 < Shiroi_Neko> not a troll
2008-05-19 10:03 < Shiroi_Neko> he gets a 48 hour block after each point violation
2008-05-19 10:03 < cimon> there is remarkable case law on ancestors stopping use of intellectual property more than century after it lapsed in theory, on the grounds that it was distortive of the artists intent.
2008-05-19 10:04 < kim_> wow
2008-05-19 10:04 < kim_> ok
2008-05-19 10:04 < quanticle> Shiroi_Neko: Well, he's also a vandal - he vandalized [[Pentagon]], and [[World Trade Center]], not to mention [[USS Cole]] and our embassies in [[Kenya]] and [[Ethiopia]]
2008-05-19 10:04 < kim_> so no setup in finland
2008-05-19 10:04 < Shiroi_Neko> no
2008-05-19 10:05 < Shiroi_Neko> Osama bin Laden is like Colbert
2008-05-19 10:05 < Shiroi_Neko> he makes others vandalise
2008-05-19 10:05 < Shiroi_Neko> he himself isnt a vandal
2008-05-19 10:05 < cimon> kim_: I am not sure if that has been repaired in subsequent law making, but there are nearly as chilling aspects to the finnish situation as there are to the UK one.
2008-05-19 10:05 < kim_> cimon, hey, we've got some really interesting board candidates this year!
2008-05-19 10:05 * kim_ says, now having actually read the page
2008-05-19 10:05 < kim_> Shiroi_Neko, meatpuppeteer!
2008-05-19 10:06 * kim_ might not even want to run
2008-05-19 10:06 < cimon> Kohs and Kurt Weber should start a comedy duo.
2008-05-19 10:06 < kim_> I would love to see siebrand run
2008-05-19 10:06 < quanticle> Shiroi_Neko: That's true. [[User:Osama bin Laden]] is a meatpuppeteer.
2008-05-19 10:06 < Shiroi_Neko> and a Pov pusher
2008-05-19 10:07 < StayWheels> cimon - I read that entire article you recommended
2008-05-19 10:08 < quanticle> cimon: They should add Monobi to form a trio.
2008-05-19 10:08 < cimon> StayWheels: which one, the one on the joke country?
2008-05-19 10:08 < StayWheels> no - technology and politics
2008-05-19 10:08 < StayWheels> technocracy
2008-05-19 10:08 < cimon> hmm
2008-05-19 10:08 < cimon> right Technocracy (movement)
2008-05-19 10:08 < StayWheels> they seem a little hive like if you ask me
2008-05-19 10:09 < StayWheels> its a powerful movement
2008-05-19 10:09 * quanticle would love to live in a Technocracy, but is afraid that technocracy may be an untenable form of governance.
2008-05-19 10:09 < StayWheels> Gene R. and all that
2008-05-19 10:09 < StayWheels> but its not for me -
2008-05-19 10:10 < cimon> well, that whole era in american politics was crazy.
2008-05-19 10:10 < cimon> Upton Sinclair, Ham and Eggs
2008-05-19 10:10 < StayWheels> yes
2008-05-19 10:10 < StayWheels> well its still crazy that you have to wear seatbelts -
2008-05-19 10:11 < cimon> scientology is the only child of that era that still amounts to anything.
2008-05-19 10:11 < StayWheels> risk to a degree should be held as part of a personal choice
2008-05-19 10:12 < quanticle> cimon: Which era?
2008-05-19 10:12 < StayWheels> its like the "non-smoking outdoor cafe"
2008-05-19 10:12 < StayWheels> what a crock
2008-05-19 10:12 < cimon> StayWheels: right, but insurance companies should have options then...
2008-05-19 10:12 < StayWheels> insurance makes money whether they do anything or not
2008-05-19 10:13 < cimon> quanticle 1910-1945
2008-05-19 10:13 < StayWheels> You have to understand risk pooling
2008-05-19 10:13 < StayWheels> and terms like morbidity vs. life expectancy
2008-05-19 10:13 < StayWheels> which like it or not are real terms in real economics of scale.
2008-05-19 10:14 < StayWheels> You also have to understand the difference bwtween greed - and not-greed.
2008-05-19 10:15 < StayWheels> I suppose you could call not-greed - honesty?
2008-05-19 10:15 < quanticle> cimon: Indeed. That was an interesting era due to the large optimistic-pessimistic cycles.
2008-05-19 10:15 < Messedrocker> this is odd
2008-05-19 10:15 < Messedrocker> my script vomited a bunch of errors and yet it worked perfectly
2008-05-19 10:16 < StayWheels> I think we are headed for a lot worse than a recession
2008-05-19 10:16 < quanticle> StayWheels: I don't think so.
2008-05-19 10:16 < cimon> quanticle: fukyama wasn't right about history ending, but yet. I am pretty sure the only thing "new" our time will leave is mass communication.
2008-05-19 10:17 < quanticle> StayWheels: Hell, I saw more panic among bankers when the Asian Finacial Crisis of 1998 hit.
2008-05-19 10:17 < StayWheels> Depression doesn't just affect bankers
2008-05-19 10:17 < StayWheels> it affects farmers - drivers - delivery agencies.
2008-05-19 10:17 < quanticle> StayWheels: The Depression was caused by the banks, though.
2008-05-19 10:18 < cimon> StayWheels: the nice thing (if you can take it as such) is that it is only the US tanking this time.
2008-05-19 10:18 < quanticle> StayWheels: Also, there far more safety nets this time.
2008-05-19 10:18 < StayWheels> This one is going to be caused by $7.00 galon gas
2008-05-19 10:18 < cimon> No japan, no fall of the pound etc.
2008-05-19 10:18 < StayWheels> cimon - maybe
2008-05-19 10:18 * Lycurgus smiles at the notion of an objective concept of "greed".
2008-05-19 10:18 < quanticle> StayWheels: Gas won't hit $7.00. Demand will drop before then.
2008-05-19 10:19 < cimon> Euro is a nice fallback position from the dollar an the yen.
2008-05-19 10:19 < Lycurgus> gas is already $9+ in Europed.
2008-05-19 10:19 < Lycurgus> *Europe
2008-05-19 10:19 < kim_> quanticle, I dunno, What Lycurgus says
2008-05-19 10:19 < StayWheels> quanticle there are speculators on TV claiiming it will hit 7.00 / gallon in the US by 2009
2008-05-19 10:19 < quanticle> cimon: Indeed, but I question the Euro zone's ability to sustain the currently high interest rates.
2008-05-19 10:19 < cimon> basically we have four global currencies already.
2008-05-19 10:20 < kim_> quanticle, how are interest rates linked to fuel prices? or are you answering someone else?
2008-05-19 10:20 < quanticle> StayWheels: Those same speculators said the NASDAQ would hit 10,000 at the height of the dot-com bubble.
2008-05-19 10:20 < kim_> cimon, couldn't the euro just be merged into the "earth"
2008-05-19 10:20 < Lycurgus> yen, euro, dollar and what yuan?
2008-05-19 10:20 < cimon> quanticle: the defining moment was when an american rapper flashed wads of euros in his music video...
2008-05-19 10:20 < StayWheels> And were they right?
2008-05-19 10:20 < quanticle> kim_: I'm saying that disproportionately high interest rates in the Euro zone are acting as a drag on the European economy by making its exports disproportionately expensive.
2008-05-19 10:21 < Lycurgus> i thought there were one two dollar and euro
2008-05-19 10:21 < cimon> Lycyrgus, yuan/pound, take your pick.
2008-05-19 10:21 < StayWheels> cimon - that was Jay-Z
2008-05-19 10:21 < Lycurgus> one on the rise and one on a decline
2008-05-19 10:21 < StayWheels> Dude I was at a shelter in 2004 and people were already starting to glom onto EUROS.
2008-05-19 10:21 < Lycurgus> (kevin phillips article in the post today gives an indication why the one is likely to continue down)
2008-05-19 10:22 < nixeagle> link :P
2008-05-19 10:22 < Lycurgus> I made the euro my standard in '02/03.
2008-05-19 10:23 < StayWheels> You can't eat computer chips - already the demand is there - for pen drives over food.
2008-05-19 10:23 < kim_> quanticle, If you say so. What's the advice for the us to get their economy back into gear?
2008-05-19 10:23 < StayWheels> Its cheaper to buy a pen drive than it is to go to Dennys
2008-05-19 10:23 * kim_ is suspicious of .us economic theory for some strange reason atm :-)
2008-05-19 10:24 < cimon> StayWheels: Edible batteries on the other hand...
2008-05-19 10:24 < quanticle> I don't like having any single currency being a standard, especially given that there's on fundamental reason for the European economy to grow while the American economy falls. After all, Europe is subject to energy shocks as well (not all of the price increases of gasoline can be explained by the fall of the dollar).
2008-05-19 10:24 < Messedrocker> QUIT REFERRING TO MY COUNTRY AS A TLD
2008-05-19 10:24 < StayWheels> cimon - those should go well with silicon
2008-05-19 10:25 < quanticle> kim_: No advice. This is the sort of financial bubble the world sees every decade or so. Last time it hit the S.E. Asian countries, Russia, and Brazil. This time its our turn.
2008-05-19 10:25 * cimon confesses he never made batteries out of potatoes as a kid, even though he was very tempted...
2008-05-19 10:25 < quanticle> kim_: Ride it out, there's not much else you can do.
2008-05-19 10:25 < Messedrocker> cimon, imo lemons make better conductors
2008-05-19 10:26 * StayWheels plans to find a way to Tokyo
2008-05-19 10:26 < quanticle> StayWheels: Why? The way I see it, Japan is up for an even harder fall than America.
2008-05-19 10:26 < Lycurgus> not so
2008-05-19 10:26 < quanticle> Lycurgus: Their birthrate is negative.
2008-05-19 10:27 < Lycurgus> they will be dragged along by the rise in china
2008-05-19 10:27 < Lycurgus> also they don't have the "idiocy as our cultural heritage" problem
2008-05-19 10:27 < cimon> Messedrocker: sure, but there never were that many lemons in our kitchen to make a series powerful enough to do much with it...
2008-05-19 10:27 < quanticle> Lycurgus: Nope. Once China finishes extracting all the expertise it needs from Nippon, they'll throw away Japan like a used towel.
2008-05-19 10:27 < StayWheels> I just want to meet people in foreign countries -
2008-05-19 10:27 < Lycurgus> which until address will see the US sink to it's natural level in the rank of nations
2008-05-19 10:27 < Messedrocker> do potatoes seriously make better conductors of electricity than lemons?
2008-05-19 10:27 < Lycurgus> *addressed
2008-05-19 10:28 < StayWheels> And tey to explain that we are not all bad.
2008-05-19 10:28 < StayWheels> try
2008-05-19 10:28 < Messedrocker> while you could connect enough lemons to make a decent power plant, the problem is the large rise of resistance
2008-05-19 10:29 < cimon> Messedrocker: I would guess not... but they are something any kitchen in finland will have many of. Lemons likely being scarce or non-xistent.
2008-05-19 10:29 < StayWheels> sorry guys - my house is like a refrigerator - I have to go lie under a blanket - summer fuel exonomy and all that - and today its cold out.
2008-05-19 10:29 < kim_> quanticle, european gas prices ahve gone up about 30 eurocents (in .nl diesel 1.00 ->1.30 gas 1.30->1.60 roughly)
2008-05-19 10:29 < Lycurgus> here too, I have the heat on.
2008-05-19 10:30 < kim_> StayWheels, which country are you from?
2008-05-19 10:30 < cimon> Messedrocker: the idea with having an experiment kids can do is it has to use items *every* house has.
2008-05-19 10:30 < kim_> quanticle, actually, that's dutch gas, dutch govt taxes the **** out of it
2008-05-19 10:30 < Shiroi_Neko> kim_ not really
2008-05-19 10:30 < Shiroi_Neko> over here over half of the price is tax
2008-05-19 10:31 < Shiroi_Neko> the price of gas is three times what you are paying
2008-05-19 10:31 < Shiroi_Neko> this is the country bordering iraq btw
2008-05-19 10:31 < Shiroi_Neko> not some lame ass island country
2008-05-19 10:31 < quanticle> kim_: By that measure, your prices are lower than in the US. 1.60 euros is 2.49 dollars. The price of gas here is 3.69 dollars or 2.37 euros.
2008-05-19 10:31 < cimon> Messedrocker: low attention span. Make the kids have to shop for lemons, and they will have lost interest by the time you get back home. and You are left sucking on lemons, the rest of the week.
2008-05-19 10:32 < Shiroi_Neko> cimon now imagine if you sent them to buy something bitter
2008-05-19 10:32 < quanticle> cimon: Or making lemonade.
2008-05-19 10:33 < kim_> quanticle, remember, we pay per LITER
2008-05-19 10:33 < cimon> and this being internet, lemonparty can't be far away...
2008-05-19 10:33 * soufron hello
2008-05-19 10:34 < Lycurgus> yello soufron
2008-05-19 10:34 < kim_> 3.78541178 * 2.49 = 9.42567533 dollars per gallon
2008-05-19 10:35 < Lycurgus> lovin teh 42s
2008-05-19 10:35 < kim_> erm round that off 9.40 dollars
2008-05-19 10:35 < Lycurgus> theys everywhere :)
2008-05-19 10:35 < kim_> 9.43
2008-05-19 10:37 < Shiroi_Neko> kim_ or 300$ a barrel
2008-05-19 10:37 < kim_> quanticle, I think .nl gas is about 3 times the price of the usa
2008-05-19 10:37 < Shiroi_Neko> a really large barrel
2008-05-19 10:37 < kim_> quanticle, maybe don't buy petrol here ;-)
2008-05-19 10:37 < Shiroi_Neko> kim in nl they do pot
2008-05-19 10:37 < Shiroi_Neko> hardly anyone notices the price
2008-05-19 10:37 < Lycurgus> the question is what do the american people buy for a half trillion dollar a year defense establishment and other expenses, i.e. how much of the difference between $4 and $9.4 is taxes and other surcharges?
2008-05-19 10:38 < quanticle> kim_: Yeah, ok. Now that prime makes more sense.
2008-05-19 10:38 < quanticle> *price
2008-05-19 10:38 < Lycurgus> other things be equal, being closer to the source, should be cheaper in Europe.
2008-05-19 10:39 < Lycurgus> *being
2008-05-19 10:39 < kim_> quanticle, and we even have the shell hq here
2008-05-19 10:39 < kim_> :-P
2008-05-19 10:39 < kim_> go figure
2008-05-19 10:39 * kim_ mutters about insane taxes too
2008-05-19 10:40 < quanticle> Lycurgus: Well, to be fair, very little of America's oil comes from Saudi. Most of our oil comes from Venezuela and Mexico, so its not clear that Europe is closer to the source than America, given that there are multiple sources.
2008-05-19 10:40 < Lycurgus> ah, that explains the transport factor. The underlying commodity has a world price though.
2008-05-19 10:41 < Lycurgus> (ie. the transport factor cancels for US and Europe, maybe not for East Asia)
2008-05-19 10:41 < quanticle> Lycurgus: Not true. There are multiple types of crude oil. Venezuelan heavy crude is generally cheaper in Europe, since there's less refining capacity for it (hence less demand).
2008-05-19 10:43 < Lycurgus> beside the point, I believe, unless the expression "price of oil per barrel" is a complete
2008-05-19 10:43 < quanticle> Lycurgus: The price quoted on the news is the price of Saudi "light sweet" crude, which is the "benchmark", if you will.
2008-05-19 10:43 < Lycurgus> obfuscation of some underlying variation which I don't think it is.
2008-05-19 10:44 < Lycurgus> like everything else solution of this problem is blocked by an overall imbecile model of social organization
2008-05-19 10:45 < quanticle> Lycurgus: Its true that the various types of oil tend to track each other in price, but I don't think its fair to say there's a single price for the underlying commodity, since there isn't a single underlying commodity, but multiple commodities that are only partially substitutable for one another.
2008-05-19 10:45 < Lycurgus> nothing can happen till it's worked out how it fits in with corporate interests that generally have very modest motivations for or interest in change
2008-05-19 10:46 < Lycurgus> view in the overal matrix of global production assigning a single variable to that commodity is perfectly reasonable
2008-05-19 10:46 < Lycurgus> *viewed
2008-05-19 10:47 < kim_> Lycurgus, I think we need to reorganize the planet ;-)
2008-05-19 10:47 < Shiroi_Neko> Venezuela hates US
2008-05-19 10:47 < Shiroi_Neko> I thouht they stoped selling oil to the us
2008-05-19 10:47 < Shiroi_Neko> and start selling to europe instead
2008-05-19 10:48 < quanticle> Shiroi_Neko: Hardly. European refiner's can't crack Venezuelan heavy crude into gasoline nearly as efficiently as our Texan and Louisinanan refineries.
2008-05-19 10:48 < quanticle> *refiners
2008-05-19 10:48 < Fabexplosive> hello
2008-05-19 10:49 < Shiroi_Neko> sure they can
2008-05-19 10:49 < Shiroi_Neko> :P
2008-05-19 10:49 < Lycurgus> kim_: agreed.
2008-05-19 10:49 < kim_> But start with wikipedia
2008-05-19 10:49 < kim_> urgh
2008-05-19 10:49 < quanticle> Shiroi_Neko: Perhaps after a couple billion dollars of improvements, perhaps.
2008-05-19 10:49 < kim_> some people are really awful
2008-05-19 10:49 < kim_> I think we're dead in the with BLP
2008-05-19 10:50 < kim_> quick survey: who here thinks that currently wikipedia is adequately dealing with biographies of living persons?
2008-05-19 10:50 < quanticle> kim_: I don't think we're doing all that badly in that regard.
2008-05-19 10:51 < Shiroi_Neko> I think all bios are bio-cruft
2008-05-19 10:53 < kim_> quanticle, we're not?
2008-05-19 10:53 * kim_ scratches head
2008-05-19 10:53 < Lycurgus> kim_: also agree, the head of the BLP is dead. The body is vital but the villification of New Labor hasn't really gotten traction within the party yet has it?
2008-05-19 10:54 < kim_> Lycurgus, eh?
2008-05-19 10:54 < kim_> Oh, lol
2008-05-19 10:55 < Lycurgus> same as with the US democrats.
2008-05-19 10:55 < Lycurgus> they spent so much fucking time "triangulating" they became virtual tories.
2008-05-19 10:56 < Lycurgus> (assumed BLP = British Labor Party)
2008-05-19 10:57 < quanticle> Lycurgus: The fact that I managed to get that without your explanation means that I'm slowly becoming British, I think.
2008-05-19 10:58 < Lycurgus> like 'Barry' and his flag lapel pin and his protestations in belief in Jesus Christ as his personal savior
2008-05-19 10:58 < Broooooooce> jesus christ
2008-05-19 10:58 < Broooooooce> the ED rfd is the longest most convoluted thing I've ever seen.
2008-05-19 11:00 < Lycurgus> and a fake always looks bad next to the real thing. That's what McCain is counting on.
2008-05-19 11:03 < quanticle> Broooooooce: Yeah. No kidding. I still don't know why ED is up for AfD. I mean, if Uncyclopedia deserves an entry, then so should ED.
2008-05-19 11:03 < Broooooooce> aint that the truth
2008-05-19 11:04 < Broooooooce> uncylopedia is dreadful
2008-05-19 11:04 < Broooooooce> and lower traffic
2008-05-19 11:04 < Broooooooce> not that being dreadful is a criteria for not having an article (if only...)
2008-05-19 11:04 < quanticle> Lycurgus: Huh? How is McCain more of the "real thing" than Obama?
2008-05-19 11:04 < Broooooooce> Seems to me a bunch of people are pissed by the content (I dont like it!) and are clinging to this notability life raft with all their heart.
2008-05-19 11:05 < Broooooooce> which to me, seems a bit POV and retarded.
2008-05-19 11:05 < quanticle> Broooooooce: I think a lot of the posters on that thread are trying weasel their personal disgust at ED into some kind of policy reasoning.
2008-05-19 11:05 < Broooooooce> the sheer volume of the parties interested in the AFD speaks volumes toward it's notability
2008-05-19 11:05 < Broooooooce> Quanticle: Precisely.
2008-05-19 11:05 < Broooooooce> It's kind of ugly to watch.
2008-05-19 11:06 < nsh> what's all this nonsense?
2008-05-19 11:06 < nsh> oh
2008-05-19 11:06 < nsh> the same nonsense as always
2008-05-19 11:06 < Broooooooce> Not to mention that the actions of the community only feed the ED stereotype of wikipedian editors.
2008-05-19 11:06 < quanticle> Broooooooce: Yeah. Its a bit like a lynching, really.
2008-05-19 11:07 < Broooooooce> If you can't laugh at yourself . . . I think just fighting so hard against it makes the community look bad.
2008-05-19 11:07 < nsh> can we not just make the software lie to the people who want the article deleted such it looks to them like it's gone
2008-05-19 11:07 < nsh> because, lord knows, no-one else gives a fuck
2008-05-19 11:07 < Broooooooce> nsh: a good idea, but unfortunately, zealots don't just want for themselves not to view it but to control everyone else viewing of it as well
2008-05-19 11:08 < LUUSAP> Guys? I need help finding an article. You see, I'm looking to read about [[retractable rollerblades]]- those special shoes kids (and some teens) wear that they can retract the wheels into the shoes and walk, and extend out again to blade on. But as you can see, that article doesn't exist. What else is it called? (And no, [[retractable rollerskates]] doesn't exist either.)
2008-05-19 11:08 < Broooooooce> Hmmm
2008-05-19 11:08 < nsh> LUUSAP: i think this might be an article you have to create
2008-05-19 11:08 < quanticle> LUUSAP: [[Heelies]]?
2008-05-19 11:08 < Broooooooce> Ill dig around for you Luusap, but it may not exist yet
2008-05-19 11:08 < nsh> although, maybe under "Heelys"
2008-05-19 11:08 < LUUSAP> They've been around for over a year, found at [[Journeys]] and other shoe stores. They ought to have an article by now.
2008-05-19 11:08 < Broooooooce> Heelys works.
2008-05-19 11:08 < nsh> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heelys
2008-05-19 11:09 < LUUSAP> Ok, I'll look there, quanticle.
2008-05-19 11:09 < nsh> boom, headshot
2008-05-19 11:09 < Lycurgus> quanticle: he's more of a conservative, what Obama is trying establish cred as with the pin and jesus
2008-05-19 11:09 < Broooooooce> That was fast :D
2008-05-19 11:09 < Lycurgus> (among many other positions, statements, and actions)
2008-05-19 11:10 < Lycurgus> change you can believe in ...
2008-05-19 11:10 < LUUSAP> Ok, made redirects. Thanks, quan.
2008-05-19 11:10 < Lycurgus> if you're a sucker
2008-05-19 11:10 < nsh> gotta take some balls to hit the vert ramp with a tiny wheel in each shoe