freenode #wikipedia

2008-03-06 04:32 < brown_cat> hahaha
2008-03-06 04:32 < Mike_H> oh, God
2008-03-06 04:32 < Mike_H> no
2008-03-06 04:32 * Mike_H gives an 8 to sevenless
2008-03-06 04:32 * sevenless becomes one
2008-03-06 04:34 * Mike_H NP: Madonna - Into the Groove (1985)
2008-03-06 04:35 < thedj> morning all
2008-03-06 04:36 < Mike_H> hi thedj
2008-03-06 04:46 < monokrome> Hello
2008-03-06 04:47 < monokrome> If an article was deleted without just reason, how can it be brought back?
2008-03-06 04:47 * brown_cat gives monokrome a wand
2008-03-06 04:47 < monokrome> :o
2008-03-06 04:49 < nokmar> admins can do it.
2008-03-06 04:49 < JohnReaves2> Mike42:You poked?
2008-03-06 04:50 < monokrome> How do I get hold of an admin?
2008-03-06 04:50 < JohnReaves2> What article is it?
2008-03-06 04:51 < Mike42> JohnReaves2: Ah yes I did. I'll PM
2008-03-06 04:51 < monokrome> Neurocam International
2008-03-06 04:52 < monokrome> It says "There's no actual properly researched, substantiated, and published information to be had on the topic", however there are thousands of people involved in it. There are lots of people that are still part of it. Just because it's a secretive organization doesn't mean that it doesn't exist and information isn't able to be verified.
2008-03-06 04:53 < monokrome> Doesn't seem like just reasoning in this case.
2008-03-06 04:53 < JohnReaves2> monokrome:It's verified crap about some publicity stunt
2008-03-06 04:53 < JohnReaves2> plenty of reason to delete
2008-03-06 04:53 < monokrome> Publicity stunt? What did they try to make public?
2008-03-06 04:55 < monokrome> No specific group has benefit from it.
2008-03-06 04:58 < theINC> With the "cite this page" feature, is there an automatic generation for [[Harvard referencing]]?
2008-03-06 04:59 < monokrome> JohnReaves2: There is noone that has really benefit from this. Nor is there a rule against wikipedia containing information about a publicity stunt. I don't see you removing articles like these: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Celebritarian_Corporation
2008-03-06 05:00 < monokrome> ugh
2008-03-06 05:00 < monokrome> I suppose that one was deleted, too.
2008-03-06 05:00 < monokrome> Stupud.
2008-03-06 05:00 < monokrome> Stupid.*
2008-03-06 05:01 < Werdna> theINC: I think Harvard is similar to MLA
2008-03-06 05:03 < theINC> Author, A. (year). "Article Name". Place of Publication: Publishers.
2008-03-06 05:03 < theINC> that's the style
2008-03-06 05:03 < theINC> also including access dates and URLs if using online sources
2008-03-06 05:03 < theINC> and page numbers and the like
2008-03-06 05:04 < JohnReaves2> monokrome:Wikipedia is an encyclopedia. How is it encyclopedic?
2008-03-06 05:09 < monokrome> JohnReaves2:
2008-03-06 05:09 < monokrome> An encyclopedia, encyclopaedia or (traditionally) encyclopædia is a comprehensive written compendium that contains information on all branches of knowledge or a particular branch of knowledge.
2008-03-06 05:10 < monokrome> How is it not "encyclopedic"?
2008-03-06 05:10 < JohnReaves2> the onus is on you to provide a reasoning for why it is worthy of inclusion, not on me
2008-03-06 05:10 < AdamBishop> I don't even know what you're talking about but I'm inclined to agree with John
2008-03-06 05:10 < monokrome> It's a group. The group exists. There are facts presented in the document.
2008-03-06 05:11 < JohnReaves2> Have you read our requirement for inclusion?
2008-03-06 05:11 < JohnReaves2> simply existing isn't one of them
2008-03-06 05:12 < JohnReaves2> *criteria
2008-03-06 05:12 < monokrome> Regardless of why or how it exists, it has existed for at least seven years, and it is not something that can't be verified.
2008-03-06 05:12 < monokrome> Yes, I have.
2008-03-06 05:12 < JohnReaves2> then prove it is notable and provide sources
2008-03-06 05:12 < monokrome> If it's a matter of citations, I will personally go through it and do the research to cite information on it. I've already done plenty and been involved in it enough anyway.
2008-03-06 05:13 < monokrome> I don't mind maintaining the document, but I do mind the fact that it was a speedy deletion even though it is verifiable.
2008-03-06 05:13 < AdamBishop> (what are you talking about anyway?)
2008-03-06 05:14 < monokrome> And I'm not one to complain normally, either. I just feel that this was an unjust deletion. Especially considering it was "speedy".
2008-03-06 05:14 < monokrome> AdamBishop: Neurocam International
2008-03-06 05:14 < nokmar> um.
2008-03-06 05:16 < AdamBishop> hmm.
2008-03-06 05:16 < AdamBishop> reminds me of the similarily unnecessary [[Obay]]
2008-03-06 05:17 < monokrome> It should have been marked with {{verify}} in my opinion.
2008-03-06 05:17 < monokrome> I can see why [[Obay]] is unnecessary
2008-03-06 05:17 < AdamBishop> why?
2008-03-06 05:18 < AdamBishop> to the first statement, that is
2008-03-06 05:20 < monokrome> Because the fact that it's a secretive organization isn't good enough reasoning for speedy deletion. Informaton on the page is verifiable, and doesn't go against the requirements for inclusion.
2008-03-06 05:21 < monokrome> The comment left upon deletion is obviously a matter that suggests the use of {{verify}}
2008-03-06 05:21 < monokrome> Not speedy deletion
2008-03-06 05:22 < AdamBishop> meh. Thousands more articles could be speedily deleted and it would be a massive improvement
2008-03-06 05:22 < monokrome> Regardless of OPINION, it was an unjust speedy deletion.
2008-03-06 05:30 < monokrome> Here's another secretive group: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Secret_Service
2008-03-06 05:30 < monokrome> Gonna delete that, too?
2008-03-06 05:31 < AdamBishop> ...no.
2008-03-06 05:32 < monokrome> But it fits into the reasoning why NCI's article was deleted, perfectly.
2008-03-06 05:32 < monokrome> "There's no actual properly researched, substantiated, and published information to be had on the topic."
2008-03-06 05:33 < monokrome> Look at the references.
2008-03-06 06:51 < AAA^> brown_cat_! \o/
2008-03-06 06:51 < brown_cat_> :D
2008-03-06 06:51 < NotACow> MOOOOOOOOO!
2008-03-06 06:51 * brown_cat_ snuggles aa
2008-03-06 06:52 < brown_cat_> AAA^*
2008-03-06 06:52 * AAA^ gives NotACow some hay
2008-03-06 06:55 * NotACow is laughing at the idiocy that is wikipedia's bureaucrats
2008-03-06 06:55 * Arria pets brown_cat_
2008-03-06 06:55 * brown_cat_ snuggles Arria
2008-03-06 06:55 < Fabexplosive> hey Arria, brown_cat_, notAMOOOOOO!!!
2008-03-06 06:56 * brown_cat_ cuddles Fabexplosive
2008-03-06 06:56 < Arria> Hey Fab.
2008-03-06 06:56 < brown_cat_> oh noes!!! I WAS ATTACKED BY A TRANSSEXUAL GAY WIZARD O_o
2008-03-06 06:59 < Arria> Dumbledore is a trannie now?
2008-03-06 06:59 < Arria> That's news.
2008-03-06 07:01 < NotACow> i thought he was dead.
2008-03-06 07:01 < NotACow> http://lunasantin.blogspot.com/2008/03/rianas-rfb-referendum-on-kelly-martin.html
2008-03-06 07:23 * NotACow reads nyb's comments on his proposed decision
2008-03-06 07:25 < koovz> for what case?
2008-03-06 07:29 < zvook> Mantanmoreland presumably
2008-03-06 07:31 < zvook> oh my, that's quite a read.
2008-03-06 07:31 < zvook> "Note to my 2006-2007 selfself: this is harder than it looks"
2008-03-06 07:31 < zvook> heh
2008-03-06 07:32 < zvook> -self
2008-03-06 08:03 < zvook> "our being wrong has one level of consequence if the question is whether SevenOfDiamonds is a sockpuppet of NuclearUmpf, and potentially a very different level of consequence if we set out to answer whether a well-known real-world individual has been messing around with his biography"
2008-03-06 08:03 < zvook> hehe. you can't ban somebodies like you can nobodies.
2008-03-06 08:10 < zvook> Finklestein's sausage meme gains further traction.
2008-03-06 08:22 < Faroframkallande> NotACow: I don't see why they just don't promote her
2008-03-06 08:55 < NotACow> Faroframkallande: because any b'crat who promotes Riana will be immediately added to the attack list
2008-03-06 08:56 < Werdna> why?
2008-03-06 08:56 < NotACow> Faroframkallande: that b'crat will become a "friend of the evil Kelly Martin"
2008-03-06 08:56 < Werdna> hehe
2008-03-06 08:56 < NotACow> Werdna: because there's a small but well-organized clique of editors who hate kelly martin.
2008-03-06 08:57 < Werdna> I love the smell of paranoia in the morning
2008-03-06 08:57 < AndonicO> Well organized?
2008-03-06 08:57 < AndonicO> That's new.
2008-03-06 08:57 < Faroframkallande> AndonicO: well, to derail an RFB, sure
2008-03-06 08:57 < Messedrocker> NotACow,
2008-03-06 08:57 < Messedrocker> why are you referring to yourself in the third person?
2008-03-06 08:57 < NotACow> Messedrocker;
2008-03-06 08:57 < NotACow> Messedrocker: because i'm channeling bob dole.
2008-03-06 08:58 < AndonicO> Faroframkallande: Ah, is that what they're talking about? (I'm guessing Riana's?)
2008-03-06 08:58 < Faroframkallande> yeah
2008-03-06 08:58 < NotACow> AndonicO: they're very well organized.
2008-03-06 08:58 < NotACow> AndonicO: they have mailing lists, a tennis ladder, and a secret santa pool.
2008-03-06 08:58 < Werdna> NotACow: an irc channel too
2008-03-06 08:58 < AndonicO> How come I'm not there then? :P
2008-03-06 08:58 < NotACow> ok, i made up the bit about the tennis ladder.
2008-03-06 08:58 < Doc_glasgow> "small but well-organized clique"[s]
2008-03-06 08:59 < NotACow> AndonicO: you don't hate kelly martin enough.
2008-03-06 08:59 < placebo_effect> do they have a March Madness tournement also?
2008-03-06 08:59 < NotACow> placebo_effect: they're having it now :)
2008-03-06 08:59 < placebo_effect> has it stared yet???
2008-03-06 08:59 < AndonicO> NotACow: Aww. :(
2008-03-06 08:59 < NotACow> placebo_effect: have you seen riana's RFB? :)
2008-03-06 08:59 < placebo_effect> yes i have
2008-03-06 08:59 < placebo_effect> how could i miss it?
2008-03-06 08:59 < NotACow> placebo_effect: there's your march madness :)
2008-03-06 08:59 < Doc_glasgow> We stop at noon each day to chant "death to Kelly Martin" for 3 min
2008-03-06 08:59 < Werdna> I haven't seen it.
2008-03-06 08:59 < Werdna> Doc_glasgow: you only do it once a day?
2008-03-06 09:00 < placebo_effect> for three minutes???
2008-03-06 09:00 < Doc_glasgow> Werdna: yes, but I'm a backslider
2008-03-06 09:00 < NotACow> Doc_glasgow: 3 minutes at noon? pah, that's not even close.
2008-03-06 09:00 < NotACow> Doc_glasgow: i hear the dedicated members do it for fifteen minutes six times a day.
2008-03-06 09:00 < Werdna> NotACow: I'm in the upper echelon. We never stop
2008-03-06 09:00 < Messedrocker> 90 minutes a day?
2008-03-06 09:00 < Messedrocker> what a waste
2008-03-06 09:00 < placebo_effect> 2.5 hrs of kelly martin hate?
2008-03-06 09:00 < Werdna> We hate Kelly martin
2008-03-06 09:00 < placebo_effect> 1.5*
2008-03-06 09:00 < Werdna> oops, wrong window
2008-03-06 09:01 < NotACow> placebo_effect: keeps the cockles warmed.
2008-03-06 09:01 < placebo_effect> hate causes nothing good
2008-03-06 09:01 < AndonicO> Orly?
2008-03-06 09:01 < Doc_glasgow> NotACow: the 15 min crowd are fanatics, the rest of us subscribe to the [[Two Minutes Hate]]
2008-03-06 09:02 < Werdna> i should probably go do that sleep thing
2008-03-06 09:02 < Werdna> i need the time beforehand to do my last half hour.
2008-03-06 09:09 * NotACow snickers
2008-03-06 09:10 < NotACow> wikipedia is so amusing
2008-03-06 09:10 < zvook> who was it who got kicked out of the communist party because "i zigged when i was supposed to zag"?
2008-03-06 09:11 < zvook> possibly i have the context all wrong.
2008-03-06 09:11 < te_> What is the proper way to link to a category page?
2008-03-06 09:11 < Faroframkallande> te_ [[:Category:foo]]
2008-03-06 09:11 < te_> [[Category:Blah this is the link]]
2008-03-06 09:11 < placebo_effect> [[:Category:Dogs]]
2008-03-06 09:11 < te_> I want to make it a link
2008-03-06 09:12 < placebo_effect> add the : at the begging of the link
2008-03-06 09:12 < NotACow> te_: a leading colon prevents the special-casing for Category (and Image) links from taking effect.
2008-03-06 09:12 < te_> oh, forgot the leading :
2008-03-06 09:12 < te_> oh, forgot the leadingthanks
2008-03-06 09:12 < placebo_effect> you is welcome
2008-03-06 09:16 < te_> here's another question for you: I would like to put something like "current articles with most revisions" 1. 2. 3. 4. etc.
2008-03-06 09:16 < te_> Is there a way to put that list on the front page and have it automatically update?
2008-03-06 09:19 < NotACow> Every chicken must logically have been preceded by an egg out of which it developed.
2008-03-06 09:19 < NotACow> An egg out of which it developed must logically have preceded every chicken.
2008-03-06 09:19 < NotACow> which sounds better?
2008-03-06 09:19 < mavhk> egg came first, dinosaurs had eggs
2008-03-06 09:19 < qed> former
2008-03-06 09:19 < NotACow> http://itre.cis.upenn.edu/~myl/languagelog/archives/005431.html
2008-03-06 09:19 < NotACow> qed: microsoft disagrees with you
2008-03-06 09:19 < qed> fucking paper clip...
2008-03-06 09:20 < qed> so hey, is there anyway to automatically update the most popular pages, say, the top 5 most popular pages, by linking the special page somehow
2008-03-06 09:20 < qed> or do i need to edit them by hand
2008-03-06 09:24 < qed> Anyone? Puh-puh-please?
2008-03-06 09:26 < AAA^> qed: ask an admin
2008-03-06 09:27 < AAA^> type (!)admin, but without the brackets
2008-03-06 09:27 < NotACow> !admin wash my car!
2008-03-06 09:27 < NotACow> like that
2008-03-06 09:27 < AAA^> NotACow: why aren't you muted/banned from this channel yet?
2008-03-06 09:28 * SQLDb glares at NotACow
2008-03-06 09:28 < Golbfoo> because we loves her
2008-03-06 09:28 < AAA^> joy
2008-03-06 09:28 < NotACow> AAA^: because i'm evil, and the ops here love evil.
2008-03-06 09:28 < SQLDb> AAA^: because I don't have ops! :P
2008-03-06 09:28 < Golbfoo> basically, yeah
2008-03-06 09:28 < NotACow> and besides, i cannot be banned :)
2008-03-06 09:28 < Golbfoo> the ops of this channel are part of the same subversive force kelly is
2008-03-06 09:28 < NotACow> it's one of the secret rules
2008-03-06 09:28 < Golbfoo> qed- i don't understand your question
2008-03-06 09:28 < cimon> hi
2008-03-06 09:28 * NotACow has eldritch powers far beyond the ken of mortals
2008-03-06 09:28 < cimon> Can I get an opinion on a style issue?
2008-03-06 09:29 < cimon> "In Britain, Great Tits and Blue Tits famously learned to break open the foil caps sealing bottles of milk that had been delivered to homes to get at the cream floating on top."
2008-03-06 09:29 < qed> Golbfoo: you know under special pages? There is a list of popular pages?
2008-03-06 09:29 < NotACow> cimon: don't mix plaids.
2008-03-06 09:29 < qed> I want to link to those top 5 most popular articles automatically
2008-03-06 09:29 < qed> without editing every time it might change
2008-03-06 09:29 < cimon> anyone think "famously" is a peacock term there?
2008-03-06 09:29 < Golbfoo> qed- which is the list of popular pages
2008-03-06 09:29 < Golbfoo> 'popular' doesn't appear there
2008-03-06 09:30 < Golbfoo> you mean most linked-to?
2008-03-06 09:30 < NotACow> cimon: no, i don't think so
2008-03-06 09:30 < NotACow> cimon: they are famous for doing that.
2008-03-06 09:30 < NotACow> cimon: besides, who would want to be peacockery about tits?
2008-03-06 09:30 < cimon> but isn't there a stylistically improved way of conveying the same information?
2008-03-06 09:31 < Golbfoo> i would say famously is a little over the top
2008-03-06 09:31 < qed> Golbfoo: sure
2008-03-06 09:32 < qed> take any of the special pages as an example
2008-03-06 09:32 < qed> i want only the top 5 orphaned articles to appear on the front page
2008-03-06 09:32 < qed> is there a way to do that without updating it by hand every day?
2008-03-06 09:33 < Golbfoo> I personally don't know any way to grab information from a special page automatically like that
2008-03-06 09:33 < cimon> okay, any one want to guess what article the following quotation is from?
2008-03-06 09:33 < zvook> "famously" is not a peacock term in that context
2008-03-06 09:33 < Golbfoo> you may want to leave a note asking about it on [[WP:VPT]]
2008-03-06 09:33 < cimon> "It displays references to feces, sexual desire, castration and eludes to the “safety” of masturbation."
2008-03-06 09:33 < Golbfoo> cimon- haha, what is it from
2008-03-06 09:34 < cimon> a famous painting by Salvador Dali: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Lugubrious_Game
2008-03-06 09:34 < zvook> i was gonna guess that
2008-03-06 09:34 < nazgjunk> o.O
2008-03-06 09:34 < zvook> the safety part put me off though
2008-03-06 09:34 < AAA^> qed: try a bot?
2008-03-06 09:35 < zvook> i'm puzzled as to how a painting can allude to the safety of masterbation
2008-03-06 09:35 < zvook> *tur
2008-03-06 09:35 < qed> AAA^: don't know how to do that
2008-03-06 09:35 < qed> :\
2008-03-06 09:36 < AAA^> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:BOT
2008-03-06 09:36 < AAA^> you can get someone else to do it
2008-03-06 09:36 < zvook> btw, they mean "allude" and not "elude"
2008-03-06 09:38 * zvook reads an early piece on breakdancing
2008-03-06 09:38 < zvook> "Dance steps are performed solo to an accompaniment called 'rapping' - chanting voice and percussion."
2008-03-06 09:38 < nazgjunk> well
2008-03-06 09:38 < zvook> gotta love it.
2008-03-06 09:39 < nazgjunk> i had a look at that painting
2008-03-06 09:39 < nazgjunk> it's very dali, 's all i can say
2008-03-06 09:39 < nazgjunk> http://www.abcgallery.com/D/dali/dali3a.JPG
2008-03-06 09:39 < zvook> avida dollars, the true surrealists useta call him
2008-03-06 09:40 < cimon> zvook: corrected that, and added a big fat old {{fact}} tag
2008-03-06 09:40 < zvook> his technique is good, the brushstrokes and what have you, but his paintings are boooooogus
2008-03-06 09:40 < nazgjunk> as in random rather than surreal?
2008-03-06 09:41 < zvook> pretty much
2008-03-06 09:41 < cimon> zvook: I think Dali is pretty much akin to Warhol. thier both best pieces of art were their own persons
2008-03-06 09:41 < zvook> it's possible.
2008-03-06 09:42 < zvook> actually going to a Warhol exhibition does wonders for one's opinion of him though
2008-03-06 09:42 < zvook> and his films are extraordinary in a certain sense
2008-03-06 09:42 < cimon> zvook: I prefer yves Klein
2008-03-06 09:43 < zvook> i know not Klein
2008-03-06 09:43 < cimon> an adherent of monochromatism
2008-03-06 09:43 < cimon> gold and his own special patented shade of ultramarine
2008-03-06 09:43 < zvook> sounds nice :D
2008-03-06 09:44 < zvook> i'm a fan of untramarine
2008-03-06 09:44 < zvook> and i have nothing against gold.
2008-03-06 09:44 < Messedrocker> extraordinary rendition?
2008-03-06 09:44 < zvook> yes indeed :D
2008-03-06 09:47 < Cyrius> people are having fun with the 'obama in sunglasses and pointing' photo
2008-03-06 09:47 < Cyrius> http://burkelibbey.org/images/obama_sw.jpg
2008-03-06 09:47 < Baggins> hi Cyrius
2008-03-06 09:47 < Messedrocker> hmm
2008-03-06 09:47 < Messedrocker> but how over is it?
2008-03-06 09:48 < Messedrocker> in a day of four primaries
2008-03-06 09:48 < Cyrius> what was that?
2008-03-06 09:48 < Messedrocker> hillary won three and he won one
2008-03-06 09:48 < Cyrius> last I checked obama was ahead in texas
2008-03-06 09:48 < Cyrius> the caucus count wasn't done
2008-03-06 09:48 < cimon> I think Hllary did her final strategic mistake, by beginning to talk of a combined Hillary/Obama bill...
2008-03-06 09:49 < cimon> It may be the final best choiche for the dems, but talking about it at this stage is a blunder of the first order.
2008-03-06 09:49 < Cyrius> anyway, the photo's not about facts, it's about obama with a lightsaber
2008-03-06 09:50 < cimon> According to the Finnish newspaper of record, Hillary is precisely 60 delegates behind Obama.
2008-03-06 10:09 < rw> Google is down
2008-03-06 10:10 < TheWeasel> hm
2008-03-06 10:10 < zocky> rw, no, just some DNS trouble
2008-03-06 10:10 < zocky> rw, 64.233.183.99
2008-03-06 10:11 < TheWeasel> Ah... routing problems
2008-03-06 10:11 < TheWeasel> Google doesn't like me
2008-03-06 10:12 < zocky> TheWeasel, 64.233.183.99 for you to
2008-03-06 10:12 < zocky> o
2008-03-06 10:12 < Backstretch> TheWeasel: Yes, their latest software release included code specifically designed to hate you.
2008-03-06 10:12 < TheWeasel> zocky: What's that about?
2008-03-06 10:12 < zocky> TheWeasel, an IP for google
2008-03-06 10:12 < rw> zocky, i see, thx
2008-03-06 10:13 < TheWeasel> Backstretch: Just because there's no conspiracy doesn't mean they're not after me.
2008-03-06 10:13 < TheWeasel> so google.de is down?
2008-03-06 10:14 < zocky> TheWeasel, from what I understand, there's DNS trouble in some places
2008-03-06 10:14 < TheWeasel> Oh, alright
2008-03-06 10:15 < TheWeasel> It can't be just DNS though, the IP gives me no response either
2008-03-06 10:15 < zocky> then they don't like you :)
2008-03-06 10:16 < zocky> TheWeasel, how about 64.233.161.104 ?
2008-03-06 10:16 < TheWeasel> no dice.
2008-03-06 10:16 < zocky> routing problems then
2008-03-06 10:16 < TheWeasel> As I said further up
2008-03-06 10:16 < TheWeasel> :-D
2008-03-06 10:26 < Lycurgus> there's always DNS trouble
2008-03-06 10:27 < Lycurgus> haven't deployed the rectification of names yet.
2008-03-06 10:28 < TheWeasel> I can access everything except Google
2008-03-06 10:28 < TheWeasel> so I guess it's a routing issue
2008-03-06 10:28 < zocky> TheWeasel, you're on t-online, right?
2008-03-06 10:29 < TheWeasel> right.
2008-03-06 10:29 < zocky> there's a bunch of people in #linguistics who are having the same problem
2008-03-06 10:29 < zocky> so it looks like some pipe is broken between your ISP and google
2008-03-06 10:29 * TheWeasel tracerts
2008-03-06 10:30 < AzaTht> <NewsWire> Fox News: Teen Admits Killing Father for Not Letting Him Use MySpace - http://feeds.foxnews.com/~r/foxnews/latest/~3/246790397/0,2933,335496,00.html
2008-03-06 10:30 < TheWeasel> 217.0.82.138 returns: target host inaccessible
2008-03-06 10:30 < TheWeasel> Wonder what that is
2008-03-06 10:31 < AzaTht> TheWeasel: Deutsche Telekom AG
2008-03-06 10:31 < TheWeasel> Heh.
2008-03-06 10:31 < TheWeasel> thanks
2008-03-06 10:31 < zocky> AzaTht, hey, nobody said technology can cure idiocy
2008-03-06 10:31 < AzaTht> zocky: hehe
2008-03-06 10:31 < CharW> anybody familiar with User:Poeloq
2008-03-06 10:31 < TheWeasel> so they seem to have one server entirely responsible for Google requests
2008-03-06 10:31 < AzaTht> CharW: all I know it's an user
2008-03-06 10:32 < CharW> no wai
2008-03-06 10:32 < AzaTht> yawai
2008-03-06 10:32 < TheWeasel> Brb.
2008-03-06 10:33 < CharW> anyway i asked him "how many Poeloqs does it take to screw in a lightbulb?" and he says he doesn't understand
2008-03-06 10:34 < TheWeasel> Right
2008-03-06 10:34 < CharW> that his name could be interpreted as an ethnic slur, depending on how it's pronounced
2008-03-06 10:34 < TheWeasel> So again, they seem to have one server for all Google requests and it seems to be down
2008-03-06 10:34 < AzaTht> polloc?
2008-03-06 10:35 < CharW> in this case "poe" as in edgar allen, plus "loq" as in stoq and barrel
2008-03-06 10:35 < AzaTht> TheWeasel: they?
2008-03-06 10:35 < TheWeasel> T-Online
2008-03-06 10:35 < noclip> i'm tearing my hair out here
2008-03-06 10:35 < AzaTht> TheWeasel: aha
2008-03-06 10:35 < noclip> i hate microsoft
2008-03-06 10:35 * Backstretch hands noclip rogaine
2008-03-06 10:35 < TheWeasel> uh-huh.
2008-03-06 10:35 < noclip> IE8 is a big "fuck you" to web developers
2008-03-06 10:36 < Backstretch> noclip: And you're surprised about this?????????
2008-03-06 10:36 < AzaTht> IE8?
2008-03-06 10:36 < TheWeasel> Microsoft-hating is getting old; let's move on
2008-03-06 10:36 < noclip> "now you have to develop for ie5, ie6 "standards mode", ie7 quasi-standards mode, and ie8 still-not-standards mode"
2008-03-06 10:36 < yamanbaiia> is there a guideline for using/not using autobiographies as a source?
2008-03-06 10:37 < CharW> but seriously, what if he becomes an admin and blocks a school IP...
2008-03-06 10:37 < Backstretch> I gave up trying to keep up with IE's html aneurysms. I built to W3C standards, period.
2008-03-06 10:37 < noclip> i'm this close to saying fuck it
2008-03-06 10:37 * Backstretch encourages noclip to say "fuck it"
2008-03-06 10:37 < noclip> and detecting browsers and telling IE users to go get firefox
2008-03-06 10:37 < CharW> "hey Mrs. Kowalski, our school district's IP range has been blocked by some Poeloq!"
2008-03-06 10:37 < noclip> or opera
2008-03-06 10:37 < noclip> or safari, or anything
2008-03-06 10:37 < TheWeasel> yamanbaiia: Not to my knowledge
2008-03-06 10:37 < noclip> hell, get lynx
2008-03-06 10:37 < CharW> after-school detention for sure...
2008-03-06 10:37 < Backstretch> noclip: lynx :)
2008-03-06 10:37 < AzaTht> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:IE8_beta_1_screenshot.png
2008-03-06 10:37 < noclip> anything but ie
2008-03-06 10:38 < The359> When a special meta element or its corresponding HTTP header is included in a web page, IE8 will render that page exactly like IE7 would. Users can switch between the two modes with a single click...
2008-03-06 10:38 < AzaTht> Replaceable? YES!!!
2008-03-06 10:38 < The359> Sounds reasonable
2008-03-06 10:38 < The359> ...and then restarting Internet Explorer.[4]
2008-03-06 10:38 < The359> FAIL
2008-03-06 10:38 < NotACow> The359: haha
2008-03-06 10:38 < TheWeasel> IE8 uses weird fonts
2008-03-06 10:38 < TheWeasel> err
2008-03-06 10:38 < TheWeasel> 7
2008-03-06 10:38 < noclip> TheWeasel: IE8 smooths fonts like safari
2008-03-06 10:38 < yamanbaiia> TheWeasel: it's not a "third party" source so there should be a discussion or something somewhere
2008-03-06 10:38 < TheWeasel> it all looks grey and shiny
2008-03-06 10:38 < AzaTht> The359: why would a page contain browser-specific instructions?
2008-03-06 10:38 < The359> shouldn't the IE8 screenshot be pointing to Wikipedia?
2008-03-06 10:39 < noclip> loc is PD
2008-03-06 10:39 < noclip> WP isn't
2008-03-06 10:39 < The359> ah, they changed that policy?
2008-03-06 10:39 < rw> if there are any guys from the us ( if you didn't tell allready ) - is google down there too?
2008-03-06 10:39 < AzaTht> noclip: is loc design PD?
2008-03-06 10:39 < noclip> if they did it in-house it is
2008-03-06 10:39 < TheWeasel> the only thing I like about IE is how you can mark a whole paragraph with a double click without getting a context menu in your face (as in Opera)
2008-03-06 10:40 < TheWeasel> rw: Google isn't "down"
2008-03-06 10:40 < AzaTht> rw: google works fine here
2008-03-06 10:40 < TheWeasel> T-Online is handling all Google traffic via one server, and that is down.
2008-03-06 10:40 < noclip> microsoft must love to see developers suffer
2008-03-06 10:40 < noclip> that's the only plausible explanation
2008-03-06 10:40 < rw> TheWeasel, yep i meant if there any guys in the us suffering dns / etc probs
2008-03-06 10:40 < CharW> actually this edit may suggest that english isn't his first language
2008-03-06 10:40 < CharW> http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:CharlotteWebb&diff=196084724&oldid=196084631
2008-03-06 10:40 < TheWeasel> no DNS problem, I believe
2008-03-06 10:40 < TheWeasel> IPs aren't forwarded either
2008-03-06 10:41 < rw> hm
2008-03-06 10:41 < rw> so t-online
2008-03-06 10:41 < TheWeasel> Yes.
2008-03-06 10:41 < CharW> maybe he's not being a silly sausage after all
2008-03-06 10:41 < TheWeasel> unpossible
2008-03-06 10:43 < noclip> hmm
2008-03-06 10:43 < noclip> does WP support IE5?
2008-03-06 10:43 < CharW> so does it matter that the average english speaker would probably pronounce "poeloq" as "polak"
2008-03-06 10:43 < noclip> oh god it does
2008-03-06 10:44 < TheWeasel> heh, it's fun, I can get on uncyclopedia but the google-analytics ad stuff times out
2008-03-06 10:44 < noclip> the faster major sites end support for IE5, the faster it dies in a fire
2008-03-06 10:44 < noclip> TheWeasel: google analytics = mini-NSA
2008-03-06 10:45 < noclip> read the analytics TOS
2008-03-06 10:45 < TheWeasel> I only randompage there so I don't care
2008-03-06 10:45 < TheWeasel> :-D
2008-03-06 10:45 < noclip> but analytics is everywhere
2008-03-06 10:45 < TheWeasel> yea, I'm not doing anything interesting
2008-03-06 10:45 < AzaTht> Hey, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_Explorer_8 must be fixed
2008-03-06 10:45 < AzaTht> it repeats the "Version targeting" at least three times
2008-03-06 10:46 < AzaTht> "Users can switch between the two modes with a single click and then restarting Internet Explorer."
2008-03-06 10:46 < AzaTht> "sites can opt-into IE7-like handling of content by inserting a special meta element into the web page"
2008-03-06 10:46 < TheWeasel> but Google's merger with the big ad firms brings that about, I guess
2008-03-06 10:46 < AzaTht> "Microsoft proposed Version Targeting whereby a page could be authored to a specific version of a browser using the X-UA-Compatible "
2008-03-06 10:47 < zocky> AzaTht, IE can't be fixed :P
2008-03-06 10:47 < noclip> would it be npov-hostile to use a screenshot of the acid3 test in IE8 for the article?
2008-03-06 10:48 < zvook> How worthy of note are these things where an american city or state declares a day "X Day" where X is some notable entity?
2008-03-06 10:48 < noclip> because it is a travesty
2008-03-06 10:48 < zocky> noclip, if it exists in other articles about web browsers, then by all means
2008-03-06 10:48 < AzaTht> zocky: ha ha
2008-03-06 10:49 < zvook> Would it be worthy of placement in the lead of a figure not widely known, for instance?
2008-03-06 10:49 < TheWeasel> zvook: About as noteworthy as them calling themselves "World Capital of X"
2008-03-06 10:49 < zvook> hehe weasel, i'll wait for the americans to respond tho
2008-03-06 10:49 < extractikor> hello people
2008-03-06 10:49 < TheWeasel> :-P
2008-03-06 10:49 < extractikor> I have a technical question
2008-03-06 10:49 < extractikor> I hope someone can help
2008-03-06 10:50 < extractikor> media wiki related
2008-03-06 10:50 < bumm13> try #mediawiki
2008-03-06 10:50 < zvook> TheWeasel: are you of the opinion that they are handed out like candy?
2008-03-06 10:50 < zocky> extractikor, or just ask the question
2008-03-06 10:50 * zvook has no idea
2008-03-06 10:50 < TheWeasel> Probably just an excuse to get drunk
2008-03-06 10:50 < TheWeasel> haha
2008-03-06 10:50 < bumm13> 4
2008-03-06 10:50 < TheWeasel> Berlin for instance is the World Capital of Administrative Incompetence
2008-03-06 10:50 < extractikor> yeah, good point, here goes
2008-03-06 10:50 < extractikor> can anyone tell me how you can edit the IP addresses on the history page
2008-03-06 10:51 < extractikor> ????
2008-03-06 10:51 < extractikor> I'll be eternally grateful if you know the answer
2008-03-06 10:51 < zocky> extractikor, manually in mysql
2008-03-06 10:51 < extractikor> zocky, is that the only way?
2008-03-06 10:51 < zocky> extractikor, AFAIK, yes
2008-03-06 10:51 < zocky> there's no mediawiki tool that does it
2008-03-06 10:52 < TheWeasel> isn't that like asking "how can I put my name into the land registry without buying a house"?
2008-03-06 10:52 < TheWeasel> just, you know, the other way round
2008-03-06 10:52 < The359> buy a funeral plot
2008-03-06 10:53 * zvook still awaits an american response :P
2008-03-06 10:54 < TheWeasel> "house" in a synecdochal sense
2008-03-06 10:54 < zvook> easy for you to say
2008-03-06 10:54 < bumm13> zvook: probably not all that notable
2008-03-06 10:54 * bumm13 = American
2008-03-06 10:54 < zvook> thanks bumm13
2008-03-06 10:54 < bumm13> no problem :)
2008-03-06 10:55 < AzaTht> noclip: [[Acid3]]: "As of March 2008, Microsoft has made no comment on their plans for supporting Acid3. Internet Explorer 8 Beta 1 passes 17 of the tests."
2008-03-06 10:56 < AzaTht> really like http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Acid3_ie7.png ツ
2008-03-06 10:56 < noclip> here's the screenshot
2008-03-06 10:56 < noclip> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:IE8_Acid3.png
2008-03-06 10:56 < noclip> i added it to the article
2008-03-06 10:56 < noclip> AzaTht: rofl
2008-03-06 10:56 < TheWeasel> the FA on Uncyc is rather good fun.
2008-03-06 10:56 < noclip> it couldn't even render the instructions properly
2008-03-06 10:57 < AzaTht> I'm getting 52 in ff(iw)2.0.0.12
2008-03-06 10:57 < noclip> i get 50
2008-03-06 10:58 < noclip> ff3 does a little better
2008-03-06 10:58 < AzaTht> havn't used ff3
2008-03-06 10:58 < TheWeasel> my ff gets 52/100
2008-03-06 10:58 < noclip> the best right now is a nightly build of safari
2008-03-06 10:58 < noclip> it gets something like 75
2008-03-06 10:58 < AzaTht> it's a race
2008-03-06 10:59 < noclip> if it's a race, microsoft is driving backwards
2008-03-06 10:59 < AzaTht> noclip: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Acid3_Safari_3.0.4.png ?
2008-03-06 10:59 < noclip> AzaTht: the latest nightly build
2008-03-06 10:59 * TheWeasel laughs arse off @ Uncyc FA
2008-03-06 11:00 < TheWeasel> IE 7.0 does so badly I can't even read the score
2008-03-06 11:00 < noclip> try it with ie5
2008-03-06 11:00 < TheWeasel> I think it's 12
2008-03-06 11:00 < TheWeasel> I haven't got that one
2008-03-06 11:00 < noclip> the universe will probably implode
2008-03-06 11:01 < TheWeasel> Opera gets 46
2008-03-06 11:01 * TheWeasel will continue to use FF then
2008-03-06 11:02 < noclip> ie5's acid 3 score: 0
2008-03-06 11:02 < AzaTht> noclip: not -1?
2008-03-06 11:02 < noclip> so microsoft's improvement in 3 versions has been 17
2008-03-06 11:03 < noclip> i hate ie5
2008-03-06 11:03 < noclip> i wish everyone would just end support for it
2008-03-06 11:04 < AzaTht> -5
2008-03-06 11:04 < noclip> actually
2008-03-06 11:04 < noclip> i wish microsoft would throw out the ie8 code
2008-03-06 11:04 < noclip> and start fresh
2008-03-06 11:04 < noclip> make a new web browser with no activex bullshit
2008-03-06 11:04 < anon32> Firefox 3.0 beta 3 gets.... 58
2008-03-06 11:04 < noclip> a proper DOM
2008-03-06 11:04 < noclip> in other words, firefox
2008-03-06 11:05 < noclip> in acid3, you can click on the title to see which tests a browser failed
2008-03-06 11:05 < noclip> it's very specific
2008-03-06 11:06 < AzaTht> yea
2008-03-06 11:07 < noclip> most of the ones firefox/opera/safari fail are fairly minor
2008-03-06 11:08 < AzaTht> noclip: 2.0.0.12 fails on test "0" :(
2008-03-06 11:08 < noclip> whereas IE fails in the most basic DOM interpretation, image support, etc.
2008-03-06 11:08 < noclip> they're not in order
2008-03-06 11:08 < TheWeasel> acid2 results in an orange bar before the eyes of the smiley in FF
2008-03-06 11:08 < TheWeasel> it looks disturbing
2008-03-06 11:08 < AzaTht> FF2*
2008-03-06 11:09 < TheWeasel> ya
2008-03-06 11:09 < TheWeasel> "Olympic Village: A high-tech 'green' venue for people"
2008-03-06 11:09 < noclip> wow
2008-03-06 11:09 < TheWeasel> actual headline from the Beijing 2008 page
2008-03-06 11:09 < kenlyric> well, at least green is in quotes
2008-03-06 11:09 < noclip> "privelege escalation: text file ran code"
2008-03-06 11:09 < TheWeasel> they need someone who speaks English there
2008-03-06 11:09 < noclip> that's for IE8
2008-03-06 11:10 < noclip> that's pretty horrible
2008-03-06 11:10 < TheWeasel> See, they have a sense of propriety in their structures
2008-03-06 11:11 < noclip> ffs
2008-03-06 11:11 < noclip> IE8 fails "acid1"
2008-03-06 11:11 < mkui> hello?
2008-03-06 11:11 < noclip> http://www.w3.org/Style/CSS/Test/CSS1/current/test5526c.htm#top
2008-03-06 11:14 < TheWeasel> Well, it does look kind of like an acid trip, so why call it failure?
2008-03-06 11:15 < TheWeasel> "Check out the Technical Delegates"
2008-03-06 11:15 < TheWeasel> Man, so many seductive choices on that site
2008-03-06 11:16 < AzaTht> noclip: haha
2008-03-06 11:17 < AzaTht> noclip: screenie?
2008-03-06 11:18 < AzaTht> the problem with the acid3 test, when you clock on "ACID", you can see the errors, but you can't easly copy it :(
2008-03-06 11:20 < AzaTht> had to make an screenie
2008-03-06 11:20 < AzaTht> http://aza.nehle.net/~azatoth/acid3_iw.png
2008-03-06 11:23 * TheWeasel has rarely seen a big-budget government site as incompetently drawn up as the Beijing '08 one
2008-03-06 11:23 < TheWeasel> but oh well, they've got five months more
2008-03-06 11:26 < zocky> wow, wikipedia was #1 site in UK until this month
2008-03-06 11:27 < NotACow> meeep!
2008-03-06 11:27 < NotACow> zocky: what took its place?
2008-03-06 11:27 < zocky> NotACow, youtube
2008-03-06 11:27 < NotACow> zocky: haha
2008-03-06 11:27 < NotACow> zocky: the massively multiplayer video blog outpaced the massively multiplayer text blog :)
2008-03-06 11:29 < zocky> NotACow, i have an idea for another massively multiplayer blog mashed with real world, if you have an investor and slave coders to implement it
2008-03-06 11:34 * Backstretch assigns Gary Gygax to zocky's project
2008-03-06 11:37 < NotACow> zocky: hehe
2008-03-06 11:41 * NotACow is amused as hell to see someone refer to the recent press coverage of jimmy's travails as "heresies"
2008-03-06 11:42 < NotACow> i realize it's probably a typo, but it's a damned ironic one at that
2008-03-06 11:43 < libertad> Bill Clinton and Hillary Clinton --->> http://cdn.chickipedia.com/www/images/4/49/HC002_353.jpg
2008-03-06 11:45 < The359> Hillary looks like a cunt even then
2008-03-06 11:53 < dookdook> on the "fat tail" page, i notice that it says "some reserve the term 'fat tail' for distributions only when 0<alpha<2 (i.e. only in cases with infinite variance)."
2008-03-06 11:53 < dookdook> but thats not true
2008-03-06 11:53 < dookdook> infinite variance happens all the way up to alpha < 3
2008-03-06 11:54 < dookdook> and i'm not sure it even makes sense to have Pr[X > x] ~ x^{-alpha} if 0 < alpha < 1
2008-03-06 11:58 < NotACow> DEATH TO TROLLS!
2008-03-06 11:59 < dookdook> well, i'm gonna change it...
2008-03-06 12:04 < mexicanbanana> Is there a Unicode character for [...], as in "text removed in text".
2008-03-06 12:04 < mexicanbanana> ?
2008-03-06 12:07 < mexicanbanana> So... if Bill Gates is the third richest person, where do all those rich oil sheiks rank?
2008-03-06 12:13 < TheWeasel> We have a schedule of events in Beijing 2008 on Wikipedia of which I have no idea where it came from
2008-03-06 12:13 < TheWeasel> :-/
2008-03-06 12:13 < TheWeasel> oh, it may be from the ticketing site
2008-03-06 12:14 < mexicanbanana> Hellö.
2008-03-06 12:14 < mexicanbanana> Is you homed?
2008-03-06 12:14 < TheWeasel> Höw äre yöü?
2008-03-06 12:14 < mexicanbanana> Is there a Unicode character for [...], as in "text removed in text"?
2008-03-06 12:14 < TheWeasel> It indeed is.
2008-03-06 12:14 < TheWeasel> My bad
2008-03-06 12:14 < mexicanbanana> There better be...
2008-03-06 12:15 < mexicanbanana> Since it has a freakin' snowman, it should definitely have this.
2008-03-06 12:16 < TheWeasel> yay for ticketing websites
2008-03-06 12:16 < TheWeasel> I don't think you can do that in less than three chars
2008-03-06 12:16 * Fabexplosive back
2008-03-06 12:17 < TheWeasel> I wasn't aware the non-round brackets were used normally
2008-03-06 12:17 < mexicanbanana> TheWeasel: What?
2008-03-06 12:17 < TheWeasel> Well, [...] rather than (...)
2008-03-06 12:18 < mexicanbanana> I am talking about one character. One glyph.
2008-03-06 12:19 < TheWeasel> Yea, I said I don't think it exists.
2008-03-06 12:19 < mexicanbanana> :(
2008-03-06 12:21 < ideogram> no, I seem to recall seeing it
2008-03-06 12:22 < mexicanbanana> Please try to find it.
2008-03-06 12:23 < ideogram> the only way I know how to search unicode is to pop up the special character menu in Word
2008-03-06 12:30 < The359> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:224jeff6 sweet fuck...
2008-03-06 12:30 < zvook> …
2008-03-06 12:30 < The359> ?
2008-03-06 12:31 < zvook> html for ellipses
2008-03-06 12:31 < Thehelpfulone2> The359: a problem?
2008-03-06 12:32 < The359> that page is just nuts
2008-03-06 12:32 < Thehelpfulone2> :D
2008-03-06 12:32 < Rinn> The359: Reminds me of those old "freesites."
2008-03-06 12:32 < The359> yeah
2008-03-06 12:32 < Rinn> Just needs some animated GIFs and MIDI music playing in the background.
2008-03-06 12:32 < zvook> haha
2008-03-06 12:33 < zvook> and a <marquee>
2008-03-06 12:33 * The359 is deleting the images of the cars he "claims" to own
2008-03-06 12:33 < Rinn> Of course. You must have the marquee.
2008-03-06 12:34 < Demi> i remember when you could have a page with just <H1> and <P> elements on it and people wouldn't think there was something wrong with their browser when looking at it
2008-03-06 12:36 < Thehelpfulone2> [17:27] <Thehelpfulone2> Can anyone help me decipher: http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:Thehelpfulone&diff=prev&oldid=196152568
2008-03-06 12:36 < Thehelpfulone2> [17:27] <Thehelpfulone2> Also - http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Editor_review/Thehelpfulone&curid=15030212&diff=196147056&oldid=195872611 - apparently my comments are
2008-03-06 12:36 < Thehelpfulone2> [17:28] <Thehelpfulone2> *disturbing* o.O
2008-03-06 12:36 < The359> lets flood some more
2008-03-06 12:36 < kenlyric> Demi: no, you don't remember that
2008-03-06 12:36 < kenlyric> in the early days it was embeded midis and <blink>
2008-03-06 12:37 < Thehelpfulone2> ;)
2008-03-06 12:37 < kenlyric> dear lord, gimme lynx
2008-03-06 12:38 * The359 gives kenlyric an angry Lynx
2008-03-06 12:38 < Demi> how come writely doesn't have a thing for headings?
2008-03-06 12:38 < Demi> oh it does
2008-03-06 12:38 < Demi> just way over there
2008-03-06 12:40 < NotACow> moo
2008-03-06 12:40 < ideogram> moo
2008-03-06 12:41 < Thehelpfulone2> mooooooooooooooooo
2008-03-06 12:42 < zvook> wow, a lot of blogging recently, NotACow
2008-03-06 12:43 < zvook> your posts are like buses
2008-03-06 12:43 < Thehelpfulone2> hehe
2008-03-06 12:45 < NotACow> moooooooo!
2008-03-06 12:45 < NotACow> zocky: buses?
2008-03-06 12:45 < NotACow> her
2008-03-06 12:45 < NotACow> er
2008-03-06 12:45 < NotACow> zvook: buses?
2008-03-06 12:45 < zvook> none for ages then five come at once
2008-03-06 12:45 < NotACow> zvook: i've had a lot to say lately, it seems