freenode #wikipedia

2008-02-12 18:55 < privatemusings> chick puck
2008-02-12 18:56 * privatemusings makes chicken noises
2008-02-12 18:56 < NotACow> what about parsley, sage, and rosemary?
2008-02-12 18:56 < NotACow> parsley, sage, and rosemary are good on chicken.
2008-02-12 18:56 < NotACow> so is thyme.
2008-02-12 18:56 < Messedrocker> no i am not going to scarborough fair this year
2008-02-12 18:56 < Messedrocker> too damn expensive
2008-02-12 18:56 < privatemusings> it's shit anyway
2008-02-12 18:56 < Demi> i'm not a big fan of rosemary
2008-02-12 18:56 < Messedrocker> all the way in fucking england
2008-02-12 18:56 < NotACow> rosemary rocks
2008-02-12 18:57 < privatemusings> didn't she drown in the end?
2008-02-12 18:57 < Demi> rosemary sucks, you idiot, get off my internet!
2008-02-12 18:57 < NotACow> rosemary clooney
2008-02-12 18:57 < DannyLilithborne> JordanC: yeah, tell the editor that
2008-02-12 18:57 < DannyLilithborne> he keeps reverting without discussion
2008-02-12 18:57 < Dtobias> Rosemary's Baby
2008-02-12 18:57 < DannyLilithborne> and i already fucked myself in another edit war D:
2008-02-12 18:57 < JordanC> Then just keep reverting also :D
2008-02-12 18:57 < NotACow> DannyLilithborne: banninate him!
2008-02-12 18:57 < Dtobias> Whichever side has a clique to tag-team will win.
2008-02-12 18:57 < DannyLilithborne> yeah, that'll earn me points ^_^
2008-02-12 18:58 < NotACow> DannyLilithborne: well, you gotta level up somehow.
2008-02-12 18:58 < DannyLilithborne> i'll just get the "content dispute rfc" slap that people get when no one wants to deal with their problem
2008-02-12 18:58 < NotACow> DannyLilithborne: ooh, drama +3!
2008-02-12 18:58 < NotACow> DannyLilithborne: go recruit a clique already.
2008-02-12 18:59 < NotACow> DannyLilithborne: only lamers recruit cliques on #wikipedia
2008-02-12 18:59 < NotACow> you lose!
2008-02-12 18:59 < DannyLilithborne> D:
2008-02-12 18:59 < Dtobias> The clique is losing power rapidly, though... the fact that an RfC on Mantanmoreland is being allowed to proceed is evidence of that.
2008-02-12 18:59 < NotACow> send an email to all your editor friends
2008-02-12 18:59 < NotACow> Dtobias: well, *that* clique, perhaps.
2008-02-12 19:00 * privatemusings is just catching up with all the heat on wiki at the mo.....
2008-02-12 19:00 < Dtobias> A year ago, people would get summarily banned for even hinting of ethical problems with Mantan/Sami/etc.
2008-02-12 19:00 < privatemusings> so there's an RfC about Mantanmoreland
2008-02-12 19:00 < NotACow> Dtobias: there's an rfc on mantamoreland?
2008-02-12 19:00 < privatemusings> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Requests_for_comment/Mantanmoreland
2008-02-12 19:00 < NotACow> Dtobias: is it doing anything besides attracting dramacopters?
2008-02-12 19:00 < privatemusings> it's going pretty calmly actually....
2008-02-12 19:00 < Dtobias> A month ago, their edits would be suppressed by JzG for "spreading harassment memes".
2008-02-12 19:01 < Dtobias> But now the clique is becoming powerless to stop it.
2008-02-12 19:01 < privatemusings> Patrick Bryne has asserted that Jimbo has been aware of all this for ages too.....
2008-02-12 19:01 < privatemusings> he says he's got incriminating emails which he's going to publish
2008-02-12 19:01 < privatemusings> http://www.wikback.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2713&Main=175#Post2709
2008-02-12 19:01 < Dtobias> NotACow: You're really getting out of it on Wiki affairs if you're not up on all this action.
2008-02-12 19:01 < privatemusings> interesting times no..?
2008-02-12 19:02 < NotACow> Dtobias: i have a life :)
2008-02-12 19:02 < Dtobias> I don't... that's my advantage.
2008-02-12 19:02 < privatemusings> then there's the travel stuff - has anyone confirmed that the board fly business class?
2008-02-12 19:02 < geniice> no because for the most part it isn't true
2008-02-12 19:03 < privatemusings> well that's no worries - just seems a sensible question to me...
2008-02-12 19:03 < Dtobias> What the heck does the foundation actually do anyway, beyond whatever they did back when Wikipedia was growing rapidly and the foundation had barely any staff or offices.
2008-02-12 19:03 < privatemusings> i think they actually do quite alot
2008-02-12 19:03 < geniice> officaly or really?
2008-02-12 19:03 < NotACow> Dtobias: arrange parties and fly its top members to other parties.
2008-02-12 19:03 < geniice> answer the phone
2008-02-12 19:04 < privatemusings> i'm reminded of an argument i had with a friend about charity exec.s
2008-02-12 19:04 < privatemusings> folk like the board of WorldVision, or Oxfam etc.
2008-02-12 19:04 < privatemusings> who get paid alot to support the charity
2008-02-12 19:04 < Dtobias> So, I think they could manage fine with a small office in some cheap location with a small clerical/secretarial/receptionist staff.
2008-02-12 19:05 < geniice> Dtobias speculate to accumilate
2008-02-12 19:05 < Dtobias> And no travel to exciting places, unless people want to do it on their own dime.
2008-02-12 19:05 < privatemusings> I'm not so sure - and have no major problem with them spending a bob or two
2008-02-12 19:05 < privatemusings> what I object to is disorganisation
2008-02-12 19:05 < privatemusings> and waste
2008-02-12 19:05 < privatemusings> which i think is a bigger problem.....
2008-02-12 19:05 < NotACow> Dtobias: the general impression that i've always had was that mantamoreland was a disruptive, abusive editor. am i to believe that that is not the general perception?
2008-02-12 19:05 < geniice> Dtobias the theory goes that people likely to donate to an internet project live in SF
2008-02-12 19:05 < privatemusings> he seemed to have a green light in certain article spaces....
2008-02-12 19:05 < Dtobias> NotACow: Most reasonable people think so, which excludes the Clique.
2008-02-12 19:06 < geniice> oh and boston has far too much RMS
2008-02-12 19:06 < NotACow> geniice: RMS is crazy, but he's fun-crazy :)
2008-02-12 19:06 < geniice> Dtobias classic case of the lesser of two evils
2008-02-12 19:07 < geniice> NotACow crazy I can live with. Unable to mentian a license I care aboutis more of a problem
2008-02-12 19:07 < geniice> Dtobias mantamoreland's chieft oponent is an order of magnitude more annoying
2008-02-12 19:07 < NotACow> geniice: the GFDL's defects are because RMS doesn't understand writing. :)
2008-02-12 19:08 < NotACow> Dtobias: i vageuly recall being asked to look into mantamoreland's editing once. i declined, on the grounds that i didn't give a shit.
2008-02-12 19:08 < Demi> a good business developer is critical to charities like that, and should be paid not much less than $200k a year, or you're getting amateur hour
2008-02-12 19:08 < geniice> NotACow nah the GFDL is for prinited manuals only. If you accept that it is mearly a second rate unfree license
2008-02-12 19:08 < Dtobias> geniice: So ban all the assholes on all sides.
2008-02-12 19:08 < geniice> Dtobias hard to do
2008-02-12 19:08 < NotACow> Dtobias: wikipedia could do to ban about 60% of its editors
2008-02-12 19:09 < NotACow> Dtobias: and about 90% of its admins
2008-02-12 19:09 < privatemusings> only 90%? ;-)
2008-02-12 19:09 < geniice> I thin not
2008-02-12 19:09 < privatemusings> I actually think they do a pretty good job overall....
2008-02-12 19:09 < privatemusings> it's the vested power groups which cause problems in my book....
2008-02-12 19:10 < NotACow> privatemusings: you'd be surprised how many of them are either in the power groups, vying to get in one, or vying to start their own.
2008-02-12 19:10 < Dtobias> An RFC on JzG being worked on in userspace: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Cla68/RfC/Sandbox
2008-02-12 19:10 < geniice> another one?
2008-02-12 19:10 < privatemusings> well in a way, I'm now part of the 'banned user' power group.. so I probably shouldn't throw stones....
2008-02-12 19:11 < privatemusings> does JzG ever pop onto IRC?
2008-02-12 19:11 < NotACow> Dtobias: what is JzG's protected topic, anytway?
2008-02-12 19:11 < privatemusings> i thnk he's a good man, a good editor, but he needs some help from someone he respects to fix his issues....
2008-02-12 19:11 < Dtobias> I don't think he has one... he seems to be self-appointed pit bull for the whole clique.
2008-02-12 19:11 < NotACow> Dtobias: interesting.
2008-02-12 19:12 < NotACow> Dtobias: so his interest in this is in being a bully and getting away with it.
2008-02-12 19:12 < NotACow> Dtobias: unlike, say, slimvirgin or jossi, whose interests are to protect their pet topics and get away with it.
2008-02-12 19:13 < geniice> Dtobias bah I've done a fair chunck of there things on that page
2008-02-12 19:13 < NotACow> Dtobias: i need to write up the "Strategy to Being A Successful Editor On Wikipedia" document
2008-02-12 19:13 < NotACow> geniice: and you've been desysoped, too.
2008-02-12 19:13 < privatemusings> kinda like the 'how to win an argument' one?
2008-02-12 19:13 < geniice> NotACow only what three times
2008-02-12 19:13 < privatemusings> does anyone know who wrote that on meatball?
2008-02-12 19:13 < NotACow> (a) make lots of unquestionably good edits to topics you don't really care about
2008-02-12 19:14 < NotACow> (b) spend lots of time making friends and establishing personal debts
2008-02-12 19:14 < Wikizine_guest68> suck my dick
2008-02-12 19:14 < Wikizine_guest68> suck my balls
2008-02-12 19:14 < Wikizine_guest68> suck my penis
2008-02-12 19:14 < NotACow> (c) establish yourself as an authority on appropriate editing
2008-02-12 19:14 < Dtobias> Are those (c) (d) and (e) in the list?
2008-02-12 19:15 < Wikizine_guest68> duck my tralala
2008-02-12 19:15 < NotACow> (d) bend the content of the articles you do care about to what you want them to say
2008-02-12 19:15 < Wikizine_guest68> suck my tralalalalala
2008-02-12 19:15 < NotACow> (e) use the gravitas gained via (a), (b), and (c) to run over anyone who objects
2008-02-12 19:15 < Alkivar> when did we unmute web gateway?
2008-02-12 19:15 < privatemusings> notacow - but does that unravel in the end?
2008-02-12 19:15 < NotACow> privatemusings: hasn't so far!
2008-02-12 19:16 < privatemusings> heh
2008-02-12 19:16 < NotACow> privatemusings: jayjg, slimvirgin, jossi, still pushing bias to this day!
2008-02-12 19:16 < Dtobias> (f) provoke opponents into being uncivil and then get them banned, with the help of your friends
2008-02-12 19:16 < privatemusings> am I allowed to ask what's up with Jayjg? - I was very curious about the 'all edits within a few mins of each other' thing that happened a while back
2008-02-12 19:16 < NotACow> the problem with this strategy is that it requires that you have no life.
2008-02-12 19:17 < Dtobias> (g) ascribe any further opposition to 'harassment memes' of the editors you got banned earlier, and use that to justify banning them too and suppressing all their ideas
2008-02-12 19:17 < NotACow> because you will have to commit 100+ hours a week to wikipedia to make it work
2008-02-12 19:17 < geniice> (g) get stalked but someone other than amorrow
2008-02-12 19:17 < NotACow> Dtobias: (h) stalk yourself.
2008-02-12 19:17 < Dtobias> (i) make up extreme stories of how evil the banned users are to justify a scorched earth policy for anything considered to be connected in any way to them
2008-02-12 19:18 < NotACow> Dtobias: more generally, pick fights with yourself
2008-02-12 19:18 < NotACow> Dtobias: make sure that you are absolutely erasonable and that, as your opponent, you are a total asshole
2008-02-12 19:18 < NotACow> Dtobias: this will generate broad sympathy for you down the road and make it easier to ban later, real, opponents
2008-02-12 19:19 < NotACow> Dtobias: the use of alternate service providers, colocation services, or other means of concealing your IP address will be needed to accomplish this, but such services are easily obtained.
2008-02-12 19:19 < privatemusings> so d'ya reckon the worst abuses of wikipedia are yet to come?
2008-02-12 19:19 < NotACow> privatemusings: just wait till the 2008 general election
2008-02-12 19:20 < privatemusings> indeed! - perhaps armed with notacow's manual, someone will really kick off
2008-02-12 19:21 < NotACow> Dtobias: the thing is, it's relatively simple playacting to create the sort of situations that will generate broad sympathy within the community
2008-02-12 19:21 < geniice> NotACow 2008 elections are two big
2008-02-12 19:21 < NotACow> Dtobias: it's amazing how easily wikipedians are gamed
2008-02-12 19:22 < privatemusings> isn't everyone gamed all the time though?
2008-02-12 19:22 * privatemusings pops his philosophical cap on
2008-02-12 19:22 < NotACow> Dtobias: then again, being easily gamed is virtually the prime characteristic of the cult victim
2008-02-12 19:22 < geniice> Notice that Prem Rawat has become more interesting
2008-02-12 19:22 < privatemusings> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_John_Newbolt#Vita.C3.AF_Lampada
2008-02-12 19:23 < geniice> Andries must be haveing the time of his life
2008-02-12 19:27 < geniice> "no flag has ever stopped a bullet from a gun" excuse me while I aquire a kevlar and titanium flag
2008-02-12 19:27 < TheLetterE> :|
2008-02-12 19:27 < TheLetterE> why try
2008-02-12 19:28 < Not_the_NSA> O.o
2008-02-12 19:28 < NotACow> traffic sucks
2008-02-12 19:28 < NotACow> http://www.gcmtravelstats.com/Default.aspx?selLinks1=74
2008-02-12 19:28 < TroubleClef> He problemed that he wasn't capable of being a member?
2008-02-12 19:29 < NotACow> http://www.gcmtravelstats.com/Default.aspx?selLinks1=148
2008-02-12 19:29 < ST47> When I first added it it was spelt less wrongly.
2008-02-12 19:29 < TroubleClef> Yeah, just "proben."
2008-02-12 19:29 < ST47> Yep.
2008-02-12 19:29 < ST47> Which meant 'proven'
2008-02-12 19:29 < ST47> not 'problem'
2008-02-12 19:30 < NotACow> 145 minutes circle to the Kingery
2008-02-12 19:30 < NotACow> wtf.
2008-02-12 19:30 < NotACow> two and a half hours?
2008-02-12 19:30 < NotACow> that's normally about 25 minutes
2008-02-12 19:30 < privatemusings> the mantanmoreland RfC has just hit AN by the way
2008-02-12 19:31 < privatemusings> and morven has commented that he thinks it should be dismissed.
2008-02-12 19:31 < privatemusings> i think he should be!
2008-02-12 19:31 < privatemusings> ;-)
2008-02-12 19:31 < NotACow> privatemusings: i used to think morven had sense.
2008-02-12 19:31 < geniice> really need to find a better copy of gin lane
2008-02-12 19:31 < geniice> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Beer-street-and-Gin-lane.jpg
2008-02-12 19:31 < NotACow> privatemusings: but he's proven himself to be a nice little yes-boy since being appointed to arbcom.
2008-02-12 19:31 < privatemusings> notacow - me too, what little i saw of him around - don't know about the 'yes boy' - but i find him very weak
2008-02-12 19:32 < NotACow> privatemusings: he mainly just endorses whatever he's told to endorse by the more powerful parties in the cabal.
2008-02-12 19:32 < privatemusings> well indeed.
2008-02-12 19:32 < NotACow> hence the term "yes-boy"
2008-02-12 19:33 < privatemusings> indeed - see your point...
2008-02-12 19:33 < privatemusings> so he isn't just weak all by himself?
2008-02-12 19:33 < NotACow> i think he doesn't want to make waves or risk hihs reputation
2008-02-12 19:33 < NotACow> so he goes with the flow instead of bucking it
2008-02-12 19:34 < NotACow> trapped by power
2008-02-12 19:34 < NotACow> that he cannot use
2008-02-12 19:34 < privatemusings> well that's a sure way to fail over time, I reckon....
2008-02-12 19:34 < NotACow> it's a sure way to avoid succeeding
2008-02-12 19:34 < NotACow> but he might also avoid failure.
2008-02-12 19:34 < NotACow> wikipedia is full of people afraid to take a stand
2008-02-12 19:34 < privatemusings> I've been feeling pretty positive actually over the last little while
2008-02-12 19:34 < NotACow> because if you take a stand, someone might hit you
2008-02-12 19:34 < geniice> The thing is the RFC is currently being endorsed by the usual suspects
2008-02-12 19:35 < privatemusings> because people actually seem to be doing so...
2008-02-12 19:35 < NotACow> geniice: because on wikipedia who you are means far more than what you say.
2008-02-12 19:36 < geniice> It depends
2008-02-12 19:36 < privatemusings> just made the connection between geniice and geni!
2008-02-12 19:36 * privatemusings is rather slow
2008-02-12 19:36 < NotACow> geniice: yes, it depends on who you are :)
2008-02-12 19:36 < geniice> depends on the situation
2008-02-12 19:36 < geniice> privatemusings user:geniice does redirect
2008-02-12 19:36 < privatemusings> G'day geni! - saw you around at Giovanni - I'd like to get those old pages undeleted in due course.....
2008-02-12 19:36 * privatemusings really is rather slow
2008-02-12 19:36 < geniice> privatemusings they won't be
2008-02-12 19:37 < geniice> but I can wait
2008-02-12 19:37 < privatemusings> patience is certainly required on that one - but i really don't think there's any reason for them to be deleted....
2008-02-12 19:37 < geniice> Oh there is a reason
2008-02-12 19:38 < privatemusings> beyond the fact that it embarrases Fred..
2008-02-12 19:38 < privatemusings> (it's not that bad - his concerns were kinda understandable...)
2008-02-12 19:38 < geniice> Fred has a background in US law not UK it doesn't hurt him that he doesn't know UK law
2008-02-12 19:39 < privatemusings> so what's the reason, d'ya reckon?
2008-02-12 19:39 < geniice> No there were legal threats
2008-02-12 19:39 < geniice> they came from someone who could potentialy take things to court
2008-02-12 19:39 < geniice> and the article was somewhat attackish originaly
2008-02-12 19:40 < privatemusings> much of the material (possible all actually) that was deleted is now there though....
2008-02-12 19:40 < geniice> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:User_Mantanmoreland_and_Samiharris_by_time_of_day.png isn't to convinceing any two people in the same time zone could have that close a match
2008-02-12 19:40 < geniice> privatemusings yeah only the new zeland thing missing really
2008-02-12 19:41 < privatemusings> you know - when this was all reported in Private Eye ages ago
2008-02-12 19:41 < geniice> yes
2008-02-12 19:41 < privatemusings> I got quite into it, and got a copy of the Belmarsh decision...
2008-02-12 19:41 < privatemusings> it still annoys me a little that there's a quote in the article which isn't in the decision.
2008-02-12 19:42 < privatemusings> but hey ho... don't spose it matters much in the long run!
2008-02-12 19:42 < privatemusings> re Samiharris and Mantanmorelans - it's interesting to take a look at the whole thing....
2008-02-12 19:43 < privatemusings> I think it's been said somewhere that Sami and Mantan are Uncle and Nephew....?
2008-02-12 19:43 < privatemusings> wild speculation p'raps......
2008-02-12 19:43 * privatemusings shuts up.
2008-02-12 19:43 < JordanC> O-o
2008-02-12 19:43 < JordanC> Indeed your name is correct
2008-02-12 19:45 < geniice> privatemusings what is the quote?
2008-02-12 19:45 < privatemusings> The bit attributed to Justice Jackson
2008-02-12 19:45 < privatemusings> He is entitled as an Italian avvocato to the same courteous treatment before the courts and the authorities of this country that I would expect any English solicitor or counsel to receive before the courts or the authorities in Italy."
2008-02-12 19:46 < privatemusings> it's allegedly from the transcripts of proceedings (primary source)
2008-02-12 19:46 < privatemusings> but absolutely isn't in the source given in the ref.
2008-02-12 19:46 < privatemusings> a judge to make such a comment in a decision would be ... er... unusual.
2008-02-12 19:46 < geniice> so raise the matter on the talk page
2008-02-12 19:47 < privatemusings> banned at the moment...
2008-02-12 19:47 < privatemusings> well indefinitely in fact, from BLPs - based on my edits at Giovanni.
2008-02-12 19:48 < privatemusings> my 90 day total ban lasts until the end of Feb
2008-02-12 19:48 < geniice> "“Wikipedia and Artificial Intelligence: An Evolving Synergy"
2008-02-12 19:49 < geniice> http://lit.csci.unt.edu/~wikiai08/index.php/Main_Page
2008-02-12 19:52 < koovz> geniice: but *each edit* (on that .png) is closely matched, doesn't that sway you?
2008-02-12 19:53 < zvook> (i have no opinion on the case itself)
2008-02-12 19:54 < geniice> those are edit rates and not really. Do to employment patturns people may have closely overlapping edit rate graphs. however in combination with the rest of the page it becomes more significant but only I feel to a limited extent
2008-02-12 19:54 < Messedrocker> loook at those loooow raaates
2008-02-12 19:55 < privatemusings> there's major danger of confirmation bias here....
2008-02-12 19:55 < privatemusings> I too don't think the edit times really mean much at all....
2008-02-12 19:56 < privatemusings> but I have come to the conclusion that there's enough sensible evidence for wikipedia to be justified in treating Mantanmoreland as an abuser of socks.
2008-02-12 19:56 < privatemusings> 'abuser of socks'
2008-02-12 19:56 < privatemusings> just sounds funny!
2008-02-12 19:57 < Messedrocker> reminds me of masturbation
2008-02-12 19:57 < privatemusings> you went and said it out loud.....
2008-02-12 19:57 < privatemusings> curse the death of subtlety... ;-)
2008-02-12 19:57 < geniice> Hey I have quite a collection of socks
2008-02-12 19:57 < privatemusings> and you wank alot.
2008-02-12 19:57 < privatemusings> (there, I said it out loud too!)
2008-02-12 19:57 < geniice> I deny everything
2008-02-12 19:58 < privatemusings> no smoke without fire, geniice - now that you've denied it, it must be true.....
2008-02-12 19:59 < geniice> I'm a chemist. Are you really certian I can't come up with smoke without fire?
2008-02-12 19:59 * The359 only abuses the socks that deserve it
2008-02-12 19:59 < kenlyric> anybody know how someone from Norway would pronounce "Thorin"? would the H be silent?
2008-02-12 19:59 < geniice> http://asc-parc.blogspot.com/2008/02/wikipedia-users-wed-like-to-talk-with.html
2008-02-12 20:00 < zvook> dunno, kenlyric. where are the IPA guys when you really need 'em, eh
2008-02-12 20:01 < geniice> except that comes from tolkine or an arsnic compound
2008-02-12 20:01 < kenlyric> apparently Thorin is a name in norway, and it's pronounced by someone like Torin, but I can't find any info to support either side.
2008-02-12 20:01 < kenlyric> geniice: norse mythology comes before those two, I think.
2008-02-12 20:01 < geniice> organoarsenic perhaps
2008-02-12 20:03 < zvook> i would presume the H is not silent, or else there would likely be a note from a norwegian at [[Thor]]
2008-02-12 20:03 < zvook> tenuous, i know
2008-02-12 20:04 < geniice> kenlyric finns only appear to know about the Tolkien stuff
2008-02-12 20:05 < kenlyric> tolkien got the name from norse mythology. to be fair, I didn't know that until 10 minutes ago.
2008-02-12 20:06 < privatemusings> ah well - that's a bit of a simplification, kenlyric - not entirely accurate....
2008-02-12 20:07 < kenlyric> not really. Much of the dwarf content was inspired or taken directly from norse myth.
2008-02-12 20:07 < zvook> i can't make head nor tail of [[Norwegian phonology]]
2008-02-12 20:07 < geniice> darn I find an image that I think might have copyvio issues and find that the author appears to be dead
2008-02-12 20:08 < privatemusings> you're spot on, ken, in the sense that norse myth inspired much (not just the Dwarf material)
2008-02-12 20:09 < privatemusings> but it doesn't follow that he intended Thorin to strictly follow nordic pronunciation....
2008-02-12 20:09 < kenlyric> in sweden Thor is pronounced Tor
2008-02-12 20:09 < privatemusings> he wrote about this stuff somewhere.... his letters perhaps?
2008-02-12 20:09 < kenlyric> oh, I know. He pronounced it /th/
2008-02-12 20:09 < zvook> i found that the logo promoting "girl love" in that pro-pedophilia activism article was extremely similar to that of UK ice cream company, Walls :o
2008-02-12 20:09 < kenlyric> trying to figure out the original
2008-02-12 20:10 < privatemusings> he also gave very short shrift to people that claimed he was somehow 'wrong'
2008-02-12 20:10 < Mike5> this isn't a very good illusion http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:ColourIllusion2.jpg
2008-02-12 20:11 < TroubleClef> What's the illusion?
2008-02-12 20:11 < zvook> lol
2008-02-12 20:11 < Mike5> this is great, though http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Spinning_Dancer.gif
2008-02-12 20:11 < TroubleClef> I HATE THAT ONE
2008-02-12 20:12 < zvook> ALWAYS CLOCKWISE
2008-02-12 20:12 < zvook> YOU HEAR ME
2008-02-12 20:12 < zvook> ALWAYS
2008-02-12 20:12 < Krimpet> looks clockwise to me
2008-02-12 20:13 < Mike5> scroll down so that only the feet are visible
2008-02-12 20:13 < Mike5> compare how fast they seem to move up and down
2008-02-12 20:14 < Mike5> then scroll back up and cover the same portion with a book or something
2008-02-12 20:14 < zvook> according to the source in the article, krimp, we've got "got excess spleen qi in [our] left frontal crockus"
2008-02-12 20:14 * zvook hates when that happens
2008-02-12 20:15 * Krimpet pretends to understand. :)
2008-02-12 20:15 < geniice> the only way I've ever been able to get it to reverse is when someone coloured the legs or attached trails to the feet
2008-02-12 20:16 < zvook> Krimpet: he's making fun of conclusions based on which way people see it ;)
2008-02-12 20:24 < Omtay38> concerning collapsable tables: is there a "collapse all" and/or "expand all" function?
2008-02-12 20:25 < TheWeasel> Elvis for instance first expanded and then collapsed.
2008-02-12 20:27 < TheWeasel> Tom Lantos has died?
2008-02-12 20:27 < TheWeasel> Sad.
2008-02-12 20:27 < Alkivar> who?
2008-02-12 20:27 < TheWeasel> Congress is losing many members this term.
2008-02-12 20:27 < TheWeasel> Jewish-Hungarian congressman from South San Francisco
2008-02-12 20:27 < TheWeasel> interesting life
2008-02-12 20:28 < Alkivar> ok... this photo creeps me out
2008-02-12 20:28 < Alkivar> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Ban_Ki-Moon_and_Tom_Lantos.jpg
2008-02-12 20:28 < Alkivar> who the hell is that ugly chick in the middle?
2008-02-12 20:28 < Alkivar> she looks like freaking Smeagol
2008-02-12 20:28 < TheWeasel> Mrs Moon?
2008-02-12 20:28 < TheWeasel> Probably Mrs Lantos more likely
2008-02-12 20:29 < Alkivar> yep thats what the caption says
2008-02-12 20:29 < Alkivar> his wife, Annette Lantos
2008-02-12 20:29 < Cyrius> SCARY EYES
2008-02-12 20:29 < Alkivar> yowch... no wonder he died
2008-02-12 20:29 < TheWeasel> oh yea, see, too lazy to read
2008-02-12 20:29 < Alkivar> he wanted to get away from seeing that every day!
2008-02-12 20:29 < Cyrius> tom lantos is scary too
2008-02-12 20:29 < TheWeasel> he has an interesting CV though
2008-02-12 20:30 < Cyrius> he looks like christopher walken crossed with the gary oldman dracula
2008-02-12 20:31 < Alkivar> wow... ok... someone said she reminds me of Tammy Faye Baker...
2008-02-12 20:31 < Alkivar> and you know what? i think they are right!
2008-02-12 20:31 < zvook> i think she did that thing where you paint eyes on your eyelids, for a lark at the UN
2008-02-12 20:32 < zvook> we've all done that at the UN, right?
2008-02-12 20:32 < Alkivar> shit i've done that at work
2008-02-12 20:32 < Alkivar> heh
2008-02-12 20:33 < zvook> cf. Homer's jury duty glasses
2008-02-12 20:34 < Alkivar> http://io9.com/354694/dubai-to-build-the-worlds-largest-arch-bridge-in-2012
2008-02-12 20:35 < TroubleClef> What's that building near the bottom right of the bottom picture?
2008-02-12 20:36 < TroubleClef> Or is that a pile of snow or salt or something?
2008-02-12 20:36 < Alkivar> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lSAExHBrfwU
2008-02-12 20:36 < Alkivar> thats fucking cool
2008-02-12 20:36 < Alkivar> using a Tesla Coil as a Guitar Amp
2008-02-12 20:37 < White_Cat> Alkivar well
2008-02-12 20:37 < White_Cat> whats cooler is making music using tesla coil
2008-02-12 20:38 < White_Cat> Alkivar ever licked a tesla coil?
2008-02-12 20:42 < Alkivar> http://5x5m.com/files/xtremefootball/
2008-02-12 20:42 < Alkivar> thats some pretty cool soccer
2008-02-12 20:44 < geniice> "As the Americans learned so painfully in Earth's final century, free flow of information is the only safeguard against tyranny. The once-chained people whose leaders at last lose their grip on information flow will soon burst with freedom and vitality, but the free nation gradually constricting its grip on public discourse has begun its rapid slide into despotism. Beware of he who would...
2008-02-12 20:44 < geniice> ...deny you access to information, for in his heart he dreams himself your master."
2008-02-12 20:44 < White_Cat> geniice is that talking about me?
2008-02-12 20:45 < Arfdeee> saizai:
2008-02-12 20:45 < geniice> about everyone
2008-02-12 20:45 < White_Cat> I am everyone right?
2008-02-12 20:45 < White_Cat> oh wait
2008-02-12 20:45 < White_Cat> I was noone
2008-02-12 20:45 < White_Cat> :/
2008-02-12 20:45 < geniice> and a reminder that telling people who played alpha centuri a lot that there is information they are not allowed to see may not go down too well
2008-02-12 20:47 < White_Cat> geniice umm
2008-02-12 20:47 < White_Cat> like the porn archive on en.wikipedia?
2008-02-12 20:47 < White_Cat> we all know why people want adminship...
2008-02-12 20:47 < geniice> err a) it's on commons. and b) it isn't exactly hidden
2008-02-12 20:47 < White_Cat> oh I mean the copyvios :)
2008-02-12 20:47 < Cyrius> SMAC was great
2008-02-12 20:48 < anon32> geniice, pr0n archive? say what?
2008-02-12 20:48 < geniice> http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Erotic
2008-02-12 20:48 < NotACow> chooga!
2008-02-12 20:48 < White_Cat> we had that?
2008-02-12 20:49 < anon32> o.O
2008-02-12 20:49 < geniice> spot the copyvios
2008-02-12 20:50 < anon32> geniice, remind me why we have that?
2008-02-12 20:50 * TroubleClef coughs
2008-02-12 20:50 < NotACow> YAY POOT
2008-02-12 20:51 < Cyrius> anon32: to provide a target for outrage later
2008-02-12 20:51 < White_Cat> geniice: best porn ever: http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Image:NoXXX.svg
2008-02-12 20:52 < geniice> anon32 quick way to locate likely copyvios
2008-02-12 20:53 < anon32> um, why is there a sound file in there?
2008-02-12 20:53 < White_Cat> geniice you mean people upload copyrighted porn to commons? :D
2008-02-12 20:53 < White_Cat> anon32 because it is a soundfile on porn
2008-02-12 20:53 < geniice> yes
2008-02-12 20:53 < anon32> lol
2008-02-12 20:53 < White_Cat> geniice I said it sarcasticaly
2008-02-12 20:53 < geniice> anon32 listen and find out
2008-02-12 20:53 < White_Cat> anon32 not like that O_o
2008-02-12 20:53 < anon32> I don't know any mexican
2008-02-12 20:53 < geniice> White_Cat not as much as you would expect
2008-02-12 20:54 < White_Cat> yes well
2008-02-12 20:54 < White_Cat> the more the merrier only applies to copyvios ;)
2008-02-12 20:54 < White_Cat> *copyvios on porn
2008-02-12 20:54 < Dtobias> Was Super Bowl XXX pornographic?
2008-02-12 20:54 < White_Cat> :P
2008-02-12 20:54 < White_Cat> Dtobias no it was 30
2008-02-12 20:54 < White_Cat> SB 50 will have a boring logo
2008-02-12 20:54 < Dtobias> And it wasn't the one with the wardrobe malfunction.
2008-02-12 20:56 < NotACow> stupor bowl.
2008-02-12 20:56 < quanticle> Dtobias: Sadly, no.
2008-02-12 20:56 < quanticle> Or, rather, not so sadly
2008-02-12 20:56 * quanticle just realized what he said
2008-02-12 20:57 < White_Cat> aww
2008-02-12 20:57 < Dtobias> If they keep using Roman numerals, they'll have some really long names like Super Bowl MDCCCXLVIII.
2008-02-12 20:57 < White_Cat> quanticle is on fire
2008-02-12 20:57 < White_Cat> no
2008-02-12 20:57 < White_Cat> by then people will find something better to do
2008-02-12 20:57 < quanticle> Dtobias: Not for a while yet, though. Super Bowl 1995 is a looooong ways off.
2008-02-12 20:58 < NotACow> quanticle: not even 2000 years.
2008-02-12 20:58 < NotACow> quanticle: that's barely nothing, considering humanity has been around for much longer
2008-02-12 20:58 < quanticle> NotACow: But how long have we been playing Super Bowls?
2008-02-12 20:59 < NotACow> quanticle: why would i care? :)
2008-02-12 20:59 < quanticle> NotACow: Heh.
2008-02-12 21:00 < TroubleClef> There's a "naked children" category!
2008-02-12 21:00 < quanticle> TroubleClef: O_o
2008-02-12 21:00 < brick_redux> i see that ISO639 codes are used for the interwiki links and the names of the WP sites, but i don't understand which set of the codes are in use - a mixture of 639-2 ("ar"), 639-3 ("arc"), and even longer ones ("simple"). can anyone explain the policy to me?
2008-02-12 21:01 < NotACow> "simple" isn't an ISO code
2008-02-12 21:02 < brick_redux> i don't know if there are other exceptions to the rule
2008-02-12 21:03 < NotACow> brick_redux: there is no rule.
2008-02-12 21:03 < brick_redux> like "zg-min-nan"
2008-02-12 21:03 < brick_redux> s/zg/zh/
2008-02-12 21:03 * Ceiling_Cat returns
2008-02-12 21:03 < brick_redux> NotACow, is there at least an authoritative list?
2008-02-12 21:03 < brick_redux> i can't imagine this practice would be totally ad-hoc
2008-02-12 21:04 < Ceiling_Cat> My boy, Obama, is starting to pick up some momentum
2008-02-12 21:04 < quanticle> brick_redux: Of ISO 639-3 codes?
2008-02-12 21:04 < Ceiling_Cat> meanwhile, the republicans are in disarray
2008-02-12 21:04 < Ceiling_Cat> this is a good thing
2008-02-12 21:04 < brick_redux> quanticle, i know perfectly well where to get those! :) i want the list of codes used by WP.
2008-02-12 21:04 < quanticle> Ceiling_Cat: Well, the Democrats are not any less disarrayed than the Republicans, as far as the presidential contest is concerned.
2008-02-12 21:04 < quanticle> brick_redux: There may not be such a list.
2008-02-12 21:05 < anon32> http://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page <-- why not just make Wikipedias in different languages instead?
2008-02-12 21:05 < Ceiling_Cat> quanticle - incorrect. There's a HUGE difference between the republicans and democrats
2008-02-12 21:05 < Ceiling_Cat> namely, the democrats have to choose between two candidates they like
2008-02-12 21:05 < NotACow> quanticle: there's huge differences.
2008-02-12 21:05 < Ceiling_Cat> and the republicans have to choose between two that they don;t
2008-02-12 21:05 < NotACow> hillary and obama are both decent candidates, although with huge differences
2008-02-12 21:06 < NovaDog> anon32: what are you saying? we do have 'pediae in different languages
2008-02-12 21:06 < NotACow> mccain and huckabee are both terrible candidates, but for totally different reasons
2008-02-12 21:06 < anon32> NovaDog, the stated goal of Simple English WP is to make Wikipedia accessible to people that don't speak English
2008-02-12 21:06 < quanticle> NotACow: Well, I don't think McCain's *that* terrible.
2008-02-12 21:06 < anon32> it seems kind of redundant
2008-02-12 21:06 < Gracenotes> NotACow: I haven't heard much criticism of McCain from my part of the world :) what don't you like about him?
2008-02-12 21:06 < NotACow> quanticle: from the republican point of view he's horrible.
2008-02-12 21:06 < quanticle> NotACow: Oh, right.
2008-02-12 21:06 < NotACow> quanticle: not nearly conservative enough
2008-02-12 21:07 < NotACow> quanticle: he's way too soft on illegal immigrants
2008-02-12 21:07 < Gracenotes> NotACow: other than the fact that he doesn't appeal to the base... does he have policy problems?
2008-02-12 21:07 < NotACow> Gracenotes: see above
2008-02-12 21:07 < NotACow> there are three wings in the republican party
2008-02-12 21:07 < quanticle> Gracenotes: Well he says that we'll be in Iraq for "the next hundred years."
2008-02-12 21:07 < NotACow> you've got the conservative christians
2008-02-12 21:08 < NotACow> the business tycoons
2008-02-12 21:08 < Gracenotes> quanticle: that soundbite does have context, though
2008-02-12 21:08 < White_Cat> there are three wings in the republican party <- thats why they cant fly
2008-02-12 21:08 < NotACow> and the chickenhawks
2008-02-12 21:08 < Gracenotes> which most people don't bother to include when they quote
2008-02-12 21:08 < NotACow> mccain appeals a bit to the tycoons and a lot to the chickenhawks
2008-02-12 21:08 < NovaDog> anon32: I thought it was for people who didn't speak English well... but yeah, it does seem a bit redundant
2008-02-12 21:08 < NotACow> but it's the biblebashers who make up the majority of the party
2008-02-12 21:08 < quanticle> Gracenotes: True. I don't disagree with him. I do think that, if we want any semblance of "victory" in Iraq, we'll be there for a good long time.
2008-02-12 21:08 < Gracenotes> quanticle: we didn't have a semblance of victory in Vietman because we got out too quickly :)
2008-02-12 21:09 < quanticle> Gracenotes: Its that kind of honesty that allows me to admire McCain even though I'm a Democrat.
2008-02-12 21:09 < Gracenotes> *Vietnam
2008-02-12 21:09 < NotACow> quanticle: mccain is insane
2008-02-12 21:09 < Gracenotes> NotACow: other than image problems, what's actually wrong with him? economics, for example?
2008-02-12 21:09 < NotACow> quanticle: he wants to avenge his own imprisonment.
2008-02-12 21:09 < quanticle> Gracenotes: I also thought it was refreshingly honest to hear McCain tell Detroit workers that "manufacturing jobs aren't coming back."
2008-02-12 21:10 < Gracenotes> my classmates do talk about Obama and Clinton quite a bit, not so much McCain
2008-02-12 21:10 < NotACow> Gracenotes: are you asking me how i feel about him or how the republicans feel about him?
2008-02-12 21:10 < Gracenotes> how you feel about him
2008-02-12 21:10 < Krimpet> i kinda sorta liked McCain before he started pandering to the bible belt
2008-02-12 21:10 < quanticle> Gracenotes: Well, the Democrats do have public sentiment on their side (at the moment).
2008-02-12 21:10 < Krimpet> that plus his awful stance on Iraq are what turns me off on him.
2008-02-12 21:10 < quanticle> Krimpet: Well, I understand why he's doing it, but it doesn't make it any more palatable.
2008-02-12 21:10 < NotACow> Gracenotes: he wants to prolong the war indefinitely until we "win" it, which indicates that he learned nothing from vietnam
2008-02-12 21:11 < quanticle> Krimpet: Well, at least his stance is clear: we stay 'til we win.
2008-02-12 21:11 < NotACow> Gracenotes: i think he'd create a "forever war"
2008-02-12 21:11 < NotACow> Gracenotes: and i'm not in favor of that
2008-02-12 21:11 < Gracenotes> mm, that's a problem.
2008-02-12 21:11 < quanticle> Krimpet: Unlike the wishy-washy plans proposed by other candidates.
2008-02-12 21:11 < Gracenotes> 1984 has forever-war :)
2008-02-12 21:11 < NotACow> Gracenotes: read the Forever War sometime
2008-02-12 21:12 < quanticle> NotACow: I don't think so. I think McCain is a strong believer in "finishing what you start".
2008-02-12 21:12 < Gracenotes> NotACow: it's a novel?
2008-02-12 21:12 < NotACow> Gracenotes: yes
2008-02-12 21:12 < NotACow> quanticle: iraq is a fuckup.
2008-02-12 21:12 < Gracenotes> is it anything like the concept in 1984?
2008-02-12 21:12 < Gracenotes> or is it an actual war?
2008-02-12 21:12 < NotACow> Gracenotes: not really. you should read it.
2008-02-12 21:12 < NotACow> Gracenotes: actual war.
2008-02-12 21:12 < NotACow> Gracenotes: lasting centuries
2008-02-12 21:12 * Gracenotes writes it down on his reading list
2008-02-12 21:12 < NotACow> Gracenotes: millenia, in fact
2008-02-12 21:13 < NotACow> Gracenotes: joe haldeman, iirc
2008-02-12 21:13 < quanticle> NotACow: Well, opinions vary regarding that. I personally think that its a fuckup, but I acknowledge that there is evidence that pointing to salvageability.
2008-02-12 21:13 < Gracenotes> NotACow: yes, looked up wiki article
2008-02-12 21:13 < NotACow> Gracenotes: won the hugo, also.
2008-02-12 21:14 < Gracenotes> looks like the mid-hudson library system has four copies
2008-02-12 21:14 < Krimpet> the decisive battle of the war in Iraq will be fought by the Airborne Porcine Division of the armed forces.
2008-02-12 21:14 * Gracenotes requests the title online
2008-02-12 21:14 * quanticle requests that title as well from his local library system
2008-02-12 21:14 < Gracenotes> NotACow: if McCain does run as the candidate, though, it should be a very interesting couple of months :)
2008-02-12 21:15 < geniice> there are far too many v masks in london
2008-02-12 21:15 < geniice> http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Image:Anon_London_Feb10_TCR_Protesters.jpg
2008-02-12 21:16 < quanticle> Gracenotes: I don't want Hillary to win for the same reason. The campaign will be far more interesting if its Obama vs. McCain as opposed to Hillary vs. McCain.
2008-02-12 21:17 < Gracenotes> quanticle: I think it would be good for Hillary to win the presidency, but not so much the candidacy :) if that makes sense
2008-02-12 21:17 < NotACow> Gracenotes: yes, it will be interesting.
2008-02-12 21:18 < Krimpet> it'd certainly be interesting to see how a candidate who proudly proclaims he "hates gooks" does in the race... -_-
2008-02-12 21:18 < quanticle> Gracenotes: I know what you mean, but I disagree. I think Obama is as qualified on policy matters as Hillary is. Hillary just has had more time to show her expertise.
2008-02-12 21:18 < Xihix> Anyone help me with my science homework?
2008-02-12 21:18 < quanticle> Xihix: We'll help, but we won't do it for you.
2008-02-12 21:18 < Xihix> just one question
2008-02-12 21:18 < Xihix> ok
2008-02-12 21:19 < Xihix> it has to do with forces.
2008-02-12 21:19 < Xihix> what is the difference between dropping a soccer ball and tossing a soccer ball?
2008-02-12 21:19 < Xihix> I'm thinking nothing.
2008-02-12 21:19 < privatemusings> in terms of when they hit the ground?
2008-02-12 21:19 < NotACow> hillary will be more of the same
2008-02-12 21:19 < quanticle> Xihix: With a toss you have an initial velocity upward.
2008-02-12 21:19 < NotACow> different party, same politics
2008-02-12 21:19 < privatemusings> if you assume no vertical force then they hit together....
2008-02-12 21:19 < quanticle> Xihix: A tossed ball goes up, and then comes down, whereas a dropped ball just drops.
2008-02-12 21:20 < Xihix> yes, but I don't listen in class, but
2008-02-12 21:20 < Gracenotes> quanticle: hm, maybe it's Obama's image as a demagogue that makes me less familiar with his policy. After all, I go to school, surrounded by fellow young people :)
2008-02-12 21:20 < Xihix> I remember someone mentioning nothing, as they are equal in mass and will reach down at the same time
2008-02-12 21:20 < Gracenotes> Xihix: there is a constant downwards acceleration in both cases, remember
2008-02-12 21:20 < quanticle> privatemusings: No. The tossed ball has an initial velocity upward, so it will hit later.
2008-02-12 21:20 < privatemusings> only if you toss it up!
2008-02-12 21:20 < privatemusings> i'm not certain that 'toss' implies a certain upward force
2008-02-12 21:20 < quanticle> Xihix: They'll accelerate downward at the same rate, but that doesn't mean that there's no difference.
2008-02-12 21:21 < Gracenotes> the initial velocity is 0 if dropping, positive if tossing
2008-02-12 21:21 < quanticle> privatemusings: It usually does.
2008-02-12 21:21 < Xihix> ah, I think thats what I was thinking
2008-02-12 21:21 < Xihix> about being the same
2008-02-12 21:21 < Krimpet> I'd rather take Obama over Hillary at this point, even though they'd have been among my last choices when there was still others in the race
2008-02-12 21:21 < Xihix> accelerating at the same rate
2008-02-12 21:21 < Xihix> what if you toss it harder though?
2008-02-12 21:21 < privatemusings> i'll defer to the expert tossers ;-)
2008-02-12 21:21 < Xihix> more force means more acceleration
2008-02-12 21:21 < quanticle> Xihix: It'll still accelerate downward at the same rate, it'll just have a higher initial velocity.
2008-02-12 21:21 < Gracenotes> no
2008-02-12 21:21 < Xihix> but, it doesnt mention that in question
2008-02-12 21:21 < Gracenotes> Xihix: it's the acceleration of gravity. It's a constant.
2008-02-12 21:22 < Xihix> hmm..
2008-02-12 21:22 < Gracenotes> velocity changes, and becomes more and more negative as time goes on
2008-02-12 21:22 < quanticle> Xihix: The harder toss just implies a higher v-nought
2008-02-12 21:22 < Xihix> So, they will both travel at the constant rate? is that where you're getting at?
2008-02-12 21:23 < Xihix> probably not.
2008-02-12 21:23 < Gracenotes> Xihix: think of a graph plotting velocity against time. It's a downwards sloping line in both cases, but the line is higher up when you toss it
2008-02-12 21:23 < quanticle> Xihix: ^
2008-02-12 21:23 < Xihix> that only makes it more confusing
2008-02-12 21:23 < Xihix> tell me in like
2008-02-12 21:23 < Xihix> lines
2008-02-12 21:23 < quanticle> Xihix: What do you mean?
2008-02-12 21:24 < Xihix> with drop, line goes staight down, but with toss, or projectile, it goes at a curvish thing? sloping?
2008-02-12 21:24 < quanticle> Xihix: Nope.
2008-02-12 21:24 < Xihix> Damn it.
2008-02-12 21:24 < quanticle> Xihix: It'll always follow a parabola.
2008-02-12 21:24 < quanticle> Xihix: The rate of descent is always increasing.
2008-02-12 21:25 < quanticle> Xihix: Its just that, with an initial upward toss you initially have a negative rate of descent.
2008-02-12 21:25 < Xihix> Can you really just tell me in simpler terms? This just just 8th grade physical science.
2008-02-12 21:25 < privatemusings> what does the question say exactly, xihix?
2008-02-12 21:25 < Gracenotes> Xihix: maybe this psuedo-graph might make sense to you? http://pastebin.com/m384de1c7
2008-02-12 21:26 < Gracenotes> the initial velocity is higher for tossing; it's 0 for dropping
2008-02-12 21:26 < quanticle> Xihix: The only difference between the two is that, with a toss, you're giving the ball an initial upward velocity.
2008-02-12 21:26 < Xihix> What is the difference between dropping a soccer ball and tossing a soccer ball?
2008-02-12 21:26 < Xihix> thats the question
2008-02-12 21:26 < Gracenotes> Xihix: the velocity decreases in both cases at a constant rate. See the graph.
2008-02-12 21:26 < privatemusings> can you just say 'not much'? - or are you supposed to say something about forces?
2008-02-12 21:27 < Xihix> make something of forces, I guess.
2008-02-12 21:27 < Xihix> I have a test on it tomorrow.
2008-02-12 21:27 < Xihix> I thought I knew, but since you guys know more
2008-02-12 21:27 < Xihix> you're trying to help me with terms I don't understand yet.
2008-02-12 21:27 < Gracenotes> Xihix: when velocity is positive, the ball is going up. When it's negative, the ball is going down. Note that the tossing line crosses the x-intercept -- this is when it turns around and starts going around again.
2008-02-12 21:27 < privatemusings> I'd say something like 'if you toss the ball sideways, it would hit the ground at the same time as a dropped ball
2008-02-12 21:28 < privatemusings> but if you toss it up at all, it will first go up, but slow down pretty quickly and then go down
2008-02-12 21:28 < Gracenotes> Xihix: wait... is the ball being tossed upwards, or sideways?
2008-02-12 21:28 < privatemusings> because of gravity
2008-02-12 21:28 < Xihix> God damn it, it's just supposed to be a simple question! Stop getting so into it!
2008-02-12 21:28 < Gracenotes> >.<
2008-02-12 21:28 < Xihix> Just tell me in a simple sentence
2008-02-12 21:28 < Xihix> what is the difference?
2008-02-12 21:28 < privatemusings> be careful what you wish for! - hee hee!
2008-02-12 21:28 < Gracenotes> Xihix: it makes a difference whether it's sideways or up
2008-02-12 21:29 < Xihix> it doesn't say because she doesn't expect us to go so into it
2008-02-12 21:29 < privatemusings> if you toss the ball sideways, it would hit the ground at the same time as a dropped ball
2008-02-12 21:29 < privatemusings> but if you toss it up at all, it will first go up, but slow down pretty quickly and then go down
2008-02-12 21:29 < Xihix> This is only 8th grade, simple science.
2008-02-12 21:29 < privatemusings> or to put it another way;
2008-02-12 21:29 < privatemusings> a ball that is tossed has more forces on in than a dropped ball
2008-02-12 21:29 < Gracenotes> privatemusings: no... it has the same force acting on it
2008-02-12 21:29 < privatemusings> a ball that is tossed has more forces on it than a dropped ball
2008-02-12 21:30 < privatemusings> (gravity + the force you've put into it)
2008-02-12 21:30 < privatemusings> a dropped ball just has gravity
2008-02-12 21:30 < Gracenotes> privatemusings: the measurement doesn't take impulse into account, though
2008-02-12 21:30 < privatemusings> well we're assuming you don't drop the ball in space too.....
2008-02-12 21:30 < privatemusings> ;-)
2008-02-12 21:31 < Xihix> alright
2008-02-12 21:31 < Xihix> You guys were no help
2008-02-12 21:31 < Xihix> sorry
2008-02-12 21:31 < Xihix> I'll just guess.
2008-02-12 21:31 < privatemusings> you'll be fine...
2008-02-12 21:31 < privatemusings> confusing, huh
2008-02-12 21:31 < Xihix> whatever.
2008-02-12 21:31 < privatemusings> ?
2008-02-12 21:31 < Krimpet> you get what you pay for, eh? :)
2008-02-12 21:31 < privatemusings> good luck anywhoo....!
2008-02-12 21:31 < Gracenotes> Xihix: the problem (and I had the same problem teaching my sister math) is that how much they want you to know is calculated as part of your learning experience
2008-02-12 21:31 < Xihix> I knew it like two days ago, but I forgot it while feeling sorry for myself for being so sick
2008-02-12 21:32 < Xihix> I think Grace, is that since you've learned more about this, you want to go more into it than what I'm simply asking. And, I don't need all that
2008-02-12 21:32 < Gracenotes> if they don't want you to know some things, then learning them will be an impediment to them teaching you
2008-02-12 21:32 < Gracenotes> which is kind of silly -- learning outside of the classroom and homework should be encourage, imho -- but that's modern education
2008-02-12 21:33 < Gracenotes> +d
2008-02-12 21:33 < Xihix> but
2008-02-12 21:33 < Xihix> really
2008-02-12 21:33 < Lucifer_Cat> hey cats!
2008-02-12 21:33 < Xihix> can't you just tell me very simply
2008-02-12 21:33 < Xihix> What is the difference between dropping a soccer ball and tossing a soccer ball?
2008-02-12 21:33 < Xihix> Just very, very simple answer.