freenode #wikipedia

2008-02-02 22:18 < loader> :)
2008-02-02 22:18 < Axeman> wut?
2008-02-02 22:18 < loader> <Axeman> I should get all the zombies of the Viet Cong that got killed in the Vietnam War... and have them fight against MySpace
2008-02-02 22:18 < loader> I mean this
2008-02-02 22:19 < DannyLilithborne> myspace sucks a lot D:
2008-02-02 22:20 < loader> lol
2008-02-02 22:20 * Lycurgus seconds that.
2008-02-02 22:20 < Lycurgus> it's a whole genre of punk ass sites.
2008-02-02 22:21 < loader> have a link?
2008-02-02 22:21 < loader> I'll take a look
2008-02-02 22:21 < Lycurgus> And I say that not in a good way.
2008-02-02 22:25 * loader slaps kylu around a bit with a large trout
2008-02-02 22:26 < loader> oops
2008-02-02 22:27 < loader> irssi v0.8.10-rc5 - running on Linux/SGI Prism (Intel Itanium 2 x 8 @ 1.67GHz : 32GB RAM) O_o
2008-02-02 22:30 < MessedRawker> inquiry
2008-02-02 22:30 < MessedRawker> what components of a computer could you extend through USB
2008-02-02 22:30 < Nakon> keyboard/mouse/cdrom
2008-02-02 22:30 < Nakon> webcam
2008-02-02 22:31 < tomato> hd
2008-02-02 22:31 < loader> flash
2008-02-02 22:31 < loader> scaner
2008-02-02 22:31 < loader> printer
2008-02-02 22:31 < Nakon> external hd/floppy
2008-02-02 22:31 < Nakon> etc.
2008-02-02 22:31 < loader> yep
2008-02-02 22:31 < Nakon> pretty much anything
2008-02-02 22:31 < loader> Yes, sur
2008-02-02 22:31 < loader> e
2008-02-02 22:32 * kylu waves at loader, offers him the trout back
2008-02-02 22:34 < MessedRawker> not aaaanything
2008-02-02 22:34 < MessedRawker> what about RAM?
2008-02-02 22:34 < MessedRawker> or graphics processing
2008-02-02 22:36 < kylu> graphics processing you could do if it's not fps gaming or similar
2008-02-02 22:36 < kylu> however, with USB 3.0 that's not going to be much more of a restriction
2008-02-02 22:37 < kylu> only the CPU and memory will be bottlenecked
2008-02-02 22:37 < MessedRawker> i'm working in the present
2008-02-02 22:38 < Warpath> :O
2008-02-02 22:38 < bumm13> heh
2008-02-02 22:38 < Warpath> XD XD
2008-02-02 22:38 < Warpath> probabaly w00t XD
2008-02-02 22:38 * NCC-1701-E writes a notable book called Main Page
2008-02-02 22:39 < MessedRawker> and also i take it it's not feasible to extend RAM through USB
2008-02-02 22:41 < kylu> what do you mean working in the present? it was announced at CES 2007
2008-02-02 22:42 < MessedRawker> but how many computers have USB 3.0?
2008-02-02 22:44 < kylu> not enough!
2008-02-02 22:44 < bumm13> he's gone :x
2008-02-02 22:44 < MessedRawker> <<
2008-02-02 22:44 < bumm13> oh, heh
2008-02-02 22:45 < loader> :)
2008-02-02 22:46 * bumm13 plays #1 hit Beatles songs in succession
2008-02-02 22:46 < Random832> anyone want to help me rewrite [[keyboard layout]]?
2008-02-02 22:48 < zocky> bumm13, isn't that the same as putting the "1" cd on?
2008-02-02 22:49 < bumm13> basically :)
2008-02-02 22:49 < bumm13> oddly enough, my favorite Beatles songs aren't there #1 hits (usually)
2008-02-02 22:49 < bumm13> *their
2008-02-02 22:50 < zocky> "In the UK, 1 became the Beatles' 15th #1 album with sales of 319,126 copies"
2008-02-02 22:50 < zocky> 319 thousands?
2008-02-02 22:50 < zocky> that's not that much, is it
2008-02-02 22:50 < bumm13> doesn't seem like it
2008-02-02 22:51 < zocky> yugoslav pop bands used to sell double that in the 1970s and 1980s, and the country was 3 times smaller than UK
2008-02-02 22:51 < bumm13> indeed
2008-02-02 22:52 < zocky> but, that was back before the internet, and back before CDs
2008-02-02 22:52 < zocky> when records used to be affordable, and you bought them for the sleeve and everything
2008-02-02 22:52 < bumm13> oh, that's the first *week* it was available
2008-02-02 22:53 < zocky> ah, 2.4 million total
2008-02-02 22:53 < zocky> that's not bad
2008-02-02 22:54 < bumm13> "Lady Madonna" is my least favorite #1 Beatles song
2008-02-02 22:56 < MessedRawker> laaaady madooonna
2008-02-02 22:56 < MessedRawker> children at her feet
2008-02-02 22:56 < MessedRawker> this song makes me want to piss in the street
2008-02-02 22:56 < bumm13> wtf?
2008-02-02 23:01 * bumm13 NP: Beatles - Eleanor Rigby (1966)
2008-02-02 23:04 < Leslie_S> CODE BROWN IN AISLE 4!!
2008-02-02 23:04 < Warpath> :O
2008-02-02 23:04 < MessedRawker> eww
2008-02-02 23:04 < MessedRawker> who the hell would do that in a store
2008-02-02 23:04 < Leslie_S> .....
2008-02-02 23:04 < Warpath> whoo was it? :O
2008-02-02 23:04 < Leslie_S> code brown is a shooting situation
2008-02-02 23:04 < MessedRawker> oh
2008-02-02 23:05 < MessedRawker> you shouldn't fscking call it code BROWN then
2008-02-02 23:05 < Leslie_S> thats what they call it
2008-02-02 23:05 < MessedRawker> you had a code brown at wal-mart today?
2008-02-02 23:05 < Leslie_S> hell no.
2008-02-02 23:05 < Leslie_S> actually, we had the other kind of code brown
2008-02-02 23:05 < Leslie_S> i came in and this one girl was complaining that she had to clean up some poop
2008-02-02 23:05 < MessedRawker> *eww*
2008-02-02 23:06 * jeremyb wonders if Leslie_S is referring to chicago
2008-02-02 23:06 < Leslie_S> ,.....
2008-02-02 23:06 < Leslie_S> why would i be?
2008-02-02 23:07 < jeremyb> shooting in a store?
2008-02-02 23:07 < Leslie_S> MessedRawker ever hear that one about the pirate though?
2008-02-02 23:07 < MessedRawker> what
2008-02-02 23:07 < Leslie_S> jeremyb No, that's one of the emergency codes that walmart has.
2008-02-02 23:07 < Leslie_S> jeremyb my store has never had one though.
2008-02-02 23:07 < Leslie_S> and realistically its expanded to "act of violence"
2008-02-02 23:07 < jeremyb> Leslie_S: ohh... you know what i'm referring to though?
2008-02-02 23:07 < Leslie_S> jeremyb not really?
2008-02-02 23:08 < jeremyb> http://nytimes.com/2008/02/02/us/02cnd-mall.html
2008-02-02 23:08 < Leslie_S> MessedRawker there was a bunch of enemy ships coming, and the captain asked one of his men to bring him his red shirt. the man asked why, and he said "so nobody will notice if i get shot".
2008-02-02 23:09 < Leslie_S> MessedRawker a few days later, even more enemy ship come, and he asks the man to bring him his brown pants.
2008-02-02 23:09 < Leslie_S> :D :D
2008-02-02 23:09 < jeremyb> or alternatively [[n:5 dead in Chicago-area store shooting]]
2008-02-02 23:15 < Leslie_S> lol
2008-02-02 23:15 < Leslie_S> today?
2008-02-02 23:16 < jeremyb> Leslie_S: 12 1/2 hours back
2008-02-02 23:16 < jeremyb> err
2008-02-02 23:17 < jeremyb> 11 1/2
2008-02-02 23:17 < jeremyb> damn timezones
2008-02-02 23:18 < jeremyb> toolserver's still having issues?
2008-02-02 23:18 * jeremyb thought that was dealt with
2008-02-02 23:18 < jeremyb> (just noticed /topic)
2008-02-02 23:18 < MessedRawker> how many sentences would you say the average wikipedia article is
2008-02-02 23:19 < jeremyb> ahh "Status: yarrow down for database reimport, and no one knows when it will back up"
2008-02-02 23:19 < autocracy> jeremyb: the toolserver is in the tank, and not coming out any time soon
2008-02-02 23:19 < MessedRawker> i'll say 30 as a liberal guess
2008-02-02 23:19 < autocracy> jeremyb: think weeks
2008-02-02 23:19 < bumm13> why is so borked?
2008-02-02 23:19 < bumm13> *is it
2008-02-02 23:19 < jeremyb> bumm13: bad disk caused DB issues istr
2008-02-02 23:20 < bumm13> arg
2008-02-02 23:20 < autocracy> unknown.. passed memtest, passed disk checks
2008-02-02 23:20 < autocracy> submitted as a bug to mysql
2008-02-02 23:20 < jeremyb> orly
2008-02-02 23:20 < bumm13> wow
2008-02-02 23:20 < autocracy> keeps crashing on the same import of one particular user database...
2008-02-02 23:20 < jeremyb> bumm13: was about to say: originally thought to be mysql bug
2008-02-02 23:20 < bumm13> fun stuff :P
2008-02-02 23:21 * jeremyb thought the disk thing was definite
2008-02-02 23:21 < bumm13> darn dolphin database
2008-02-02 23:21 < quanticle> MessedRawker: Are we talking about article space or all of Wikipedia, including user pages, talk pages, etc.
2008-02-02 23:21 < MessedRawker> no
2008-02-02 23:21 < MessedRawker> how many sentences in a wikipedia article
2008-02-02 23:21 < quanticle> MessedRawker: Oh, so just article space then...
2008-02-02 23:21 < jeremyb> autocracy: can't they just skip that db? repro with that db on different machine?
2008-02-02 23:22 < quanticle> MessedRawker: I'd say about 1000
2008-02-02 23:22 < quanticle> Oops
2008-02-02 23:22 < quanticle> 100 rather
2008-02-02 23:22 < autocracy> jeremyb: yes, they could skip over that db... i don't know anything else about what holds them back
2008-02-02 23:22 < quanticle> Stupid sticky zero key
2008-02-02 23:22 < quanticle> autocracy: It could be an important db...
2008-02-02 23:22 < autocracy> it may still be the disk. i'm not sure how much was checked
2008-02-02 23:23 < autocracy> quanticle: it's a user db, and even if important, better to have all but that than nothing? anyway... moot point
2008-02-02 23:23 < jeremyb> quanticle: i assumed "user db" meant db for a particular app... then you can just leave that single app out of commission
2008-02-02 23:23 < autocracy> i do not have admin access, so i can't explore anymore. i've told you at this point basically all i know.
2008-02-02 23:23 < jeremyb> autocracy: iirc it was all being ported to zfs in order to eliminate disks one by one
2008-02-02 23:24 < autocracy> i'm sorry... i didn't eleaborate right... i meant what jeremyb said... it's a user login thing
2008-02-02 23:24 < quanticle> Well, if the "user db" is the list of allowed users, then it might not be possible to skip it.
2008-02-02 23:24 * jeremyb hands quanticle some magic unsticker gunk
2008-02-02 23:24 < autocracy> jeremyb: yes, but i don't know if they filled the disk a few times over to check it or not
2008-02-02 23:24 < arcimboldo_> Hm. He's proud of having played a role in any national security crisis?
2008-02-02 23:24 < autocracy> just creating the filesystem, and even partially filling it... may simply give false confidence
2008-02-02 23:25 < jeremyb> arcimboldo_: erm?
2008-02-02 23:25 < arcimboldo_> McCain during the debate ...
2008-02-02 23:25 < MessedRawker> when using vmware, do you have to install the OS vmware is emulating on your computer?
2008-02-02 23:25 < autocracy> MessedRawker: yes.......
2008-02-02 23:25 < MessedRawker> kthx ^-^
2008-02-02 23:26 < jeremyb> autocracy: well zfs + enough mirrors through raid should let you know what's up automatically or at least be able to tell you on demand right?
2008-02-02 23:26 < quanticle> arcimboldo_: Well, I would be proud of having seen crises and the responses to such crises.
2008-02-02 23:26 < quanticle> arcimboldo_: At the very least, I'd have an idea of what works and what doesn't.
2008-02-02 23:26 < jeremyb> (but it might not notice anything immediately i guess)
2008-02-02 23:26 < autocracy> jeremyb: zfs detects corruption by performing a checksum validation of data on read.... making the filesystem happens in a moment, and doesn't run the length of the entire disk
2008-02-02 23:27 < autocracy> back in a bit... /msg me if you have any more questions
2008-02-02 23:27 < jeremyb> autocracy: but i think it has some logic that decides whether it's just corruption or really a bad disk
2008-02-02 23:29 < Zach> MessedRawker, you love metroid, right?
2008-02-02 23:29 < MessedRawker> sure, why?
2008-02-02 23:29 < Zach> you should listen to this song: http://www.soundclick.com/bands/page_songInfo.cfm?bandID=91259&songID=1341505
2008-02-02 23:31 < MessedRawker> ah, norfair in the original metroid had great music
2008-02-02 23:31 < MessedRawker> my favorite in the game
2008-02-02 23:31 < Zach> the song itself is cc-by 3.0
2008-02-02 23:31 < Zach> but since it's a remix, i think it wouldn't be totally free
2008-02-02 23:32 * jeremyb wonders what the sound at 12:40 in the video at http://energycommerce.house.gov/cmte_mtgs/110-ti_hrg.030107.WorldWideWeb.shtml is
2008-02-02 23:33 < Zach> and thus wouldn't be suitable for [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Free music]]
2008-02-02 23:34 < Zach> which is too bad, it's really an awesome song.
2008-02-02 23:34 * jeremyb finds it ironic that that page links to the wrong place for the GPO transcript and the wrong page for the exit disclaimer (404) and only offers the video in a single closed format
2008-02-02 23:34 < jeremyb> (the video is testimony of tim berners lee wrt the WWW)
2008-02-02 23:35 < jeremyb> also it says there should be a transcript within 90-120 days and that's definitely passed and none is available
2008-02-02 23:35 < jeremyb> at least from the GPO page linked adjusted for the right congress
2008-02-02 23:36 < DannyLilithborne> it was a mistake for me to watchlist Muhammad :\
2008-02-02 23:36 < DannyLilithborne> adios
2008-02-02 23:36 < Nakon> DannyLilithborne: same
2008-02-02 23:36 < DannyLilithborne> the talkpage makes me want to kill babies
2008-02-02 23:37 < Zach> !!
2008-02-02 23:38 * Zach places a plastic bag next to a crib
2008-02-02 23:40 < rory096> hmm
2008-02-02 23:40 < rory096> i just listened to the national anthem of the USSR because of stormscape's quit message
2008-02-02 23:40 < rory096> i need a life
2008-02-02 23:41 < jeremyb> rory096: you can take bags away from Zach until you manage to get one
2008-02-02 23:41 < The359> I have the national anthem from the Red October soundtrack
2008-02-02 23:41 < rory096> heh
2008-02-02 23:42 < Zach> red october standing by
2008-02-02 23:42 < The359> Simply red standing by
2008-02-02 23:42 < Zach> red foxx standing by
2008-02-02 23:42 < Gwern-away> rory096: ln pls
2008-02-02 23:42 < rory096> Gwern-away: what?
2008-02-02 23:42 * The359 can't remember any of the other Reds
2008-02-02 23:43 < Gwern-away> to the anthem
2008-02-02 23:43 < rory096> oh, hold on
2008-02-02 23:43 < bumm13> ror-raaaaaaaay!
2008-02-02 23:43 < The359> you mean we don't have a copy on Wikipedia?
2008-02-02 23:43 < rory096> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wpKRd2xQeq8
2008-02-02 23:43 < rory096> comments and video are kind of oddly pro-soviet
2008-02-02 23:43 < rory096> hey bumm13
2008-02-02 23:44 < bumm13> :)
2008-02-02 23:44 < MessedRawker> rory096!
2008-02-02 23:44 < rory096> hey MessedRawker
2008-02-02 23:45 < MessedRawker> one time towards the end of summer i spent quite some time studying the soviet national anthem
2008-02-02 23:45 < MessedRawker> becoming obsessed with it
2008-02-02 23:45 < The359> heh, nice
2008-02-02 23:45 * ronabop goes to read the baby-killing talk page, and is getting bored...
2008-02-02 23:45 < The359> we have the [[National Anthem of the Soviet Union]] performed by the United States Navy Band on Wiki
2008-02-02 23:46 < MessedRawker> commies!
2008-02-02 23:46 < rory096> The359: interesting
2008-02-02 23:47 < The359> "In 1991, The Red Army Choir participated in Roger Waters' The Wall concert celebrating the fall of the Berlin Wall. They performed an anti-war song, Bring the Boys Back Home."
2008-02-02 23:47 < The359> Also interesting
2008-02-02 23:47 < MessedRawker> hmm
2008-02-02 23:47 < MessedRawker> i just thought of something
2008-02-02 23:48 < zero1328> wow
2008-02-02 23:48 < MessedRawker> hacking apart a game boy and then sticking it in a larger console
2008-02-02 23:48 < quanticle> MessedRawker: Why?
2008-02-02 23:48 < The359> Sticking it in?
2008-02-02 23:48 < MessedRawker> i'm talking about something i'd build
2008-02-02 23:48 < The359> Like, just taking the Game Boy processors and controls and just putting them in a big box?
2008-02-02 23:49 < MessedRawker> yes
2008-02-02 23:49 < zero1328> You'd need to rewire the output into a TV screen and maybe up the voltage
2008-02-02 23:49 < The359> Why not just buy a Super Game Boy?
2008-02-02 23:50 < MessedRawker> scratch that. make it a game boy advance
2008-02-02 23:50 < zero1328> Uhh.. I think Super Gameboys are out of print
2008-02-02 23:50 < Gwern-away> why not make a mame machine and throw in a couple thousand other games/architectures?
2008-02-02 23:50 < MessedRawker> Gwern-away, that's kind of my goal
2008-02-02 23:50 < zero1328> Just get some emulators
2008-02-02 23:50 < quanticle> MessedRawker: So, why not just take apart a GameBoy and jack it directly into the TV without using a larger case?
2008-02-02 23:50 < MessedRawker> quanticle, the game boy would be part of a larger system
2008-02-02 23:51 < quanticle> MessedRawker: as zero1328 said, just get a laptop with a whole bunch of emulators.
2008-02-02 23:51 < MessedRawker> i already have a whole bunch of emulators :)
2008-02-02 23:51 < zero1328> And remember, emulators aren't illegal, downloading ROMs are
2008-02-02 23:51 < MessedRawker> exactly
2008-02-02 23:52 < zero1328> you can rip your own game images.. which is in the grey area
2008-02-02 23:52 < MessedRawker> ripping for personal use is fair use
2008-02-02 23:52 * Gwern-away imagines a world where guns are legal, it's just the bullets that are illegal
2008-02-02 23:52 < zero1328> Gun's don't kill people, Bullets do.
2008-02-02 23:53 < MessedRawker> bullets would be docile were it not for the guns
2008-02-02 23:53 < quanticle> Gwern-away: Well, not too long ago, in Minnesota it was illegal to sell fireworks, but not illegal to posess them.
2008-02-02 23:53 < Gwern-away> zero1328: except when people bash each other with the gun :)
2008-02-02 23:54 < nokram> I think pencils are deadly
2008-02-02 23:54 < nokram> you can poke people with them
2008-02-02 23:54 < MessedRawker> yeah
2008-02-02 23:54 < DannyLilithborne> and give them lead poisoning
2008-02-02 23:54 < MessedRawker> stick a whole bunch of graphite into their system
2008-02-02 23:54 < MessedRawker> DannyLilithborne, pencils are made with carbon not lead
2008-02-02 23:54 < nokram> =P
2008-02-02 23:54 < rory096> Gwern-away: huge black market would be created, even bigger than the current one for guns, since it's so easy to smuggle bullets
2008-02-02 23:55 < DannyLilithborne> MessedRawker: lead poisoning i says :D
2008-02-02 23:55 < zero1328> And it's kinda easy to craft the bullets yourself
2008-02-02 23:55 * ronabop was making bullets at age 12.
2008-02-02 23:56 < nokram> zero1328: no
2008-02-02 23:56 < nokram> if you want the bullets to actually hit your target, it's rather difficult
2008-02-02 23:56 < quanticle> nokram: Yes it is. My friend packs his own shotgun shells.
2008-02-02 23:56 < zero1328> It depends on the firearm
2008-02-02 23:56 < nokram> shotgun shells are a different matter
2008-02-02 23:56 < quanticle> nokram: The bullets don't make the gun accurate. The rifling on the barrel does.
2008-02-02 23:56 < nokram> but if you have uneven packing of explosives, you're screwed
2008-02-02 23:57 < MessedRawker> yeah, and if the bullets are disproportionately carved
2008-02-02 23:57 < MessedRawker> so that at a high speed they'd jeer in another direction
2008-02-02 23:57 < quanticle> MessedRawker: You don't carve bullets
2008-02-02 23:57 < MessedRawker> HOWEVER THEY'RE BUILT
2008-02-02 23:57 < quanticle> MessedRawker: You pour them into molds
2008-02-02 23:57 < nokram> if I put all the lead on the left and the explosive on the right it's not going to hit my target
2008-02-02 23:57 < zero1328> You don't carve, you smelt them
2008-02-02 23:57 < MessedRawker> well what if the molds are uneven then
2008-02-02 23:57 < zero1328> Why would they be uneven...
2008-02-02 23:58 < MessedRawker> because you made them and they suck?
2008-02-02 23:58 < quanticle> MessedRawker: Well thats why you get the mold from a proper gunsmith.
2008-02-02 23:58 < quanticle> MessedRawker: There are a surprising number of them.
2008-02-02 23:58 < MessedRawker> but in a world where bullets are illegal, such a transaction cannot happen
2008-02-02 23:59 < quanticle> MessedRawker: Bullets are illegal. Bullet molds are not
2008-02-02 23:59 < zero1328> Well you could always just make lead balls and make an old flintlock pistol or something
2008-02-02 23:59 < DannyLilithborne> lol
2008-02-02 23:59 < DannyLilithborne> that sounds like the preview for a movie
2008-02-02 23:59 < DannyLilithborne> "Number One with a Bullet"
2008-02-03 00:00 < DannyLilithborne> "In a world where bullets are illegal, one man takes matters into his own hands"
2008-02-03 00:00 < quanticle> zero1328: Yeah. You could call them "super soft ball bearings"
2008-02-03 00:00 < zero1328> SSBB?
2008-02-03 00:00 < MessedRawker> super smash bros. brawl
2008-02-03 00:00 < zero1328> lol
2008-02-03 00:00 < quanticle> zero1328: Sure.
2008-02-03 00:00 < nokram> =D
2008-02-03 00:01 < zero1328> Same acronym! it's a conspiracy..
2008-02-03 00:01 < rory096> nintendo's trying to make bullets illegal!
2008-02-03 00:02 * ronabop makes bows legal, but transactions in arrow making materials highly regulated
2008-02-03 00:02 < MessedRawker> and they keep teasing us by delaying the game
2008-02-03 00:02 < zero1328> no no no, Nintendo's making black market bullets!
2008-02-03 00:02 < MessedRawker> it is currently due to be released <s>december 2007</s> <s>february 2008</s> march 2008
2008-02-03 00:03 < ronabop> "Guns Don't Kill People. Nintendo Does."
2008-02-03 00:03 < bumm13> \o/
2008-02-03 00:03 < DannyLilithborne> <s>march 2008</s> WHEN IT'S DONE
2008-02-03 00:03 < MessedRawker> DannyLilithborne, it is done. it was released in japan a few days ago
2008-02-03 00:03 * bumm13 imagines someone taking the NES zapper and converting it into a real firearm
2008-02-03 00:03 < rory096> MessedRawker: huge shortages though. there seems to be a production problem, which probably caused the delays here
2008-02-03 00:03 < bumm13> (or at least something that looks similar)
2008-02-03 00:03 < DannyLilithborne> MessedRawker: woo
2008-02-03 00:04 < zero1328> There's no release date for PAL, too..
2008-02-03 00:05 < The359> the question is, why hasn't someone, bumm13?
2008-02-03 00:05 < The359> Make it a bit easier to get through security...
2008-02-03 00:05 < ronabop> bumm13: there are already laser conversions floating around...
2008-02-03 00:05 < ronabop> "Laser Guns Don't Kill People, Light Does".
2008-02-03 00:06 * ronabop regulates light
2008-02-03 00:06 < rory096> grr
2008-02-03 00:06 < rory096> my xbox 360 is broken :-/
2008-02-03 00:06 < rory096> i feel so empty inside
2008-02-03 00:08 < zero1328> How're you gonna regulate light? turn off the sun?
2008-02-03 00:10 * VartanS blows up sun.
2008-02-03 00:11 < bumm13> brrrr
2008-02-03 00:12 < zero1328> Well, good thing global warming keeps us alive
2008-02-03 00:12 < MessedRawker> rory096, it finally broke?
2008-02-03 00:12 < rory096> MessedRawker: yep
2008-02-03 00:12 < Gwern-away> neat. my computer is using all 4 cores
2008-02-03 00:13 < rory096> it's not a fucking rrod though
2008-02-03 00:13 < rory096> which means i have to pay a hundred bucks to repair it :-/
2008-02-03 00:13 < MessedRawker> Gwern-away, what are you doing?
2008-02-03 00:13 < Gwern-away> MessedRawker: well, I'm spidering WP, normalizing a gig of OGGs, compressing some photos, and compiling amarok
2008-02-03 00:14 < MessedRawker> you can dedicate a core to each!@
2008-02-03 00:14 < MessedRawker> so you're spidering WP? for what purposes
2008-02-03 00:14 < bumm13> hopefully *really slowly*
2008-02-03 00:14 < Gwern-away> dead link checking using pyweikipediabot
2008-02-03 00:14 < bumm13> otherwise possible bannination may result
2008-02-03 00:14 < jeremyb> why not doing that with a dump?
2008-02-03 00:14 < MessedRawker> there are no dumps
2008-02-03 00:14 < MessedRawker> + it's better to do it in real time
2008-02-03 00:14 < jeremyb> huh?
2008-02-03 00:14 < Gwern-away> don't think it supports that
2008-02-03 00:15 < jeremyb> and hopefully you're using action=render at least
2008-02-03 00:15 < MessedRawker> english wikipedia dumps don't really exist right now
2008-02-03 00:15 < jeremyb> MessedRawker: as of when?
2008-02-03 00:15 < MessedRawker> i don't know
2008-02-03 00:15 < bumm13> they've been failing
2008-02-03 00:15 < Gwern-away> bumm13: well, it's not going slowly for non-WP sites, esle it'd take forever. actual WP pages are being fetched a few hundred at a time every couple dozen minutes, iirc. I've got about 1k python threads spidering ext links
2008-02-03 00:16 < jeremyb> rly
2008-02-03 00:16 < bumm13> yp
2008-02-03 00:16 < bumm13> *yup
2008-02-03 00:17 < MessedRawker> one time i proposed to Where a bot that would search through existing articles looking for copyvio, one sentence at a time
2008-02-03 00:17 < MessedRawker> i just calculated how long that would take considering today's stats
2008-02-03 00:17 < MessedRawker> and it should take about 65 years
2008-02-03 00:17 < MessedRawker> now, that's assuming only one bot is doing the job
2008-02-03 00:17 < bumm13> heh
2008-02-03 00:18 < MessedRawker> if we have 130 copies of the bot on the job it'll only take six months
2008-02-03 00:18 < Gwern-away> MessedRawker: how could it look for copyvio?
2008-02-03 00:18 < MessedRawker> Gwern-away, by googling the sentence
2008-02-03 00:18 < rory096> MessedRawker: of course, that's including the rest of the sentences in an article that's already been found to be a copyvio
2008-02-03 00:18 < rory096> also, even with a "-wikipedia" in the search, mirrors still come up sometimes
2008-02-03 00:19 < MessedRawker> well the bot wouldn't take action itself
2008-02-03 00:19 < Gwern-away> MessedRawker: er... wouldn't that be horrible because of bad sites and non-compliant mirrors?
2008-02-03 00:19 < jeremyb> MessedRawker: umm... what do you do about getting access to google?
2008-02-03 00:19 < MessedRawker> non-compliant mirrors are still pretty rare
2008-02-03 00:19 < MessedRawker> jeremyb, google API
2008-02-03 00:20 < Gwern-away> although keys are getting hard to get I've heard
2008-02-03 00:20 < rory096> Gwern-away: i suppose the bot could be refined by blacklisting sites that come up frequently (and therefore must be mirrors) or whatever
2008-02-03 00:20 < jeremyb> MessedRawker: afaik they only have one API taking new apps and it's for use in browser (by js) only. and prohibits use non-interactively
2008-02-03 00:21 < Gwern-away> rory096: you'd be constantly working to whitelist/blacklist the long tail, and then there are derivative works and fair uses... oy. I wouldn't want to do that. an insane amount of work for very minimal gain. let's let daniel brandt do that kind of thing...
2008-02-03 00:21 < MessedRawker> well Where seems to be able to do it somehow
2008-02-03 00:21 < rory096> Gwern-away: true
2008-02-03 00:21 < MessedRawker> Gwern-away, daniel brandt DID that kind of thing
2008-02-03 00:21 < jeremyb> oh there's actually a [[User:Where]]?
2008-02-03 00:21 < MessedRawker> he compiled a bigass list of wiki mirrors
2008-02-03 00:21 < Nakon> jeremyb [[User:what]]?
2008-02-03 00:22 < rory096> jeremyb: yeah
2008-02-03 00:22 * jeremyb thought MessedRawker was proposing a *new* bot
2008-02-03 00:23 < rory096> he was
2008-02-03 00:23 < rory096> to where
2008-02-03 00:23 < rory096> wait what
2008-02-03 00:23 * rory096 is confused
2008-02-03 00:24 < Gwern-away> no no, who was on first
2008-02-03 00:24 < quanticle> rory096: MessedRawker was proposing a new bot, but it seems like the bot has already been made.
2008-02-03 00:25 < MessedRawker> nooo
2008-02-03 00:25 < MessedRawker> where has a SIMILAR bit
2008-02-03 00:25 < MessedRawker> bot
2008-02-03 00:25 < rory096> quanticle: he said "one time," leading me to believe he proposed this to where a long time ago
2008-02-03 00:26 < rory096> actually i have no idea what's going on
2008-02-03 00:26 < rory096> oh whale
2008-02-03 00:26 < jeremyb> hehe
2008-02-03 00:27 < quanticle> rory096: I'm not sure any of us have any idea what's going on.
2008-02-03 00:27 < rory096> quanticle: this seems to be true
2008-02-03 00:27 < MessedRawker> Where has a bot that detects newly-made articles for copyvio
2008-02-03 00:28 < MessedRawker> I proposed that he should make a similar bot that detects already existing articles for copyvio
2008-02-03 00:28 < MessedRawker> He ended up cancelling the project after calculations proved it infeasible
2008-02-03 00:28 < rory096> oh, i see
2008-02-03 00:28 < arcimboldo_> How would that be infeasible?
2008-02-03 00:29 < MessedRawker> say it takes 30 seconds to check a sentence through google
2008-02-03 00:29 < arcimboldo_> Due to the server load?
2008-02-03 00:29 < jeremyb> MessedRawker: it seems Wherebot is yahoo not google
2008-02-03 00:29 < MessedRawker> oh
2008-02-03 00:29 < MessedRawker> no arcimboldo_
2008-02-03 00:29 < rory096> arcimboldo_: 65 years for a bot to run?
2008-02-03 00:29 < MessedRawker> say it takes 15 seconds for the bot to check a sentence with google.
2008-02-03 00:30 < quanticle> rory096: Only if there's no parallelization.
2008-02-03 00:30 < rory096> i couldn't imagine how that could be infeasible :o
2008-02-03 00:30 < arcimboldo_> You could distribute it over 30 bots or so ...
2008-02-03 00:30 < MessedRawker> the average amount of sentences in an article is 100
2008-02-03 00:30 < zero1328> 65 years? what the heck?
2008-02-03 00:30 < rory096> quanticle: true
2008-02-03 00:30 < MessedRawker> multiply that by 2.2 million
2008-02-03 00:30 < MessedRawker> 15 * 100 * 2,200,000
2008-02-03 00:30 < MessedRawker> that's the amount of seconds
2008-02-03 00:30 < quanticle> rory096: Fortunately, this task is highly parallelizable.
2008-02-03 00:30 < zero1328> you using a vic 20 or something?
2008-02-03 00:30 < arcimboldo_> One difficulty with existing articles is to distinguish copies to Wikipedia from copies from Wikipedia.
2008-02-03 00:30 < quanticle> zero1328: Yeah. The 15 secs per check seems kinda long.
2008-02-03 00:30 < MessedRawker> okay, how long would it take in reality?
2008-02-03 00:30 < jeremyb> MessedRawker: well recently changed and not yet checked or substantially changed since last check would cut down quite a bit on workload
2008-02-03 00:31 < MessedRawker> i'm talking about a full inspection of all of wikipedia
2008-02-03 00:31 < MessedRawker> ok, so 5 seconds per sentence check with yahoo?
2008-02-03 00:31 < zero1328> Don't use a VIC-20.. use a C64
2008-02-03 00:31 < jeremyb> and i'm saying that's a good starting place
2008-02-03 00:31 < rory096> and then there would have to be humans doing stuff whenever it finds something
2008-02-03 00:31 < zero1328> 1.02 Mhz instead of 1 Mhz
2008-02-03 00:32 < quanticle> MessedRawker: I'd probably say 1 to 2 seconds.
2008-02-03 00:32 < jeremyb> you can check other pages after you're done with recent changes
2008-02-03 00:32 < jeremyb> (or just expand recent changes to go farther back in time)
2008-02-03 00:32 < rory096> and i have a feeling there are copyvios in a pretty high portion of articles- which means a ton of work for humans
2008-02-03 00:32 < MessedRawker> i'll adjust it to 5 seconds, to be on the safe side
2008-02-03 00:32 < jeremyb> MessedRawker: filling out the yahoo form?
2008-02-03 00:32 < MessedRawker> no
2008-02-03 00:32 < MessedRawker> i am not developing this bot
2008-02-03 00:32 < jeremyb> hehe
2008-02-03 00:33 < quanticle> MessedRawker: You don't have to even get the google page. You can generate a url representing the query and just launch that to see if there are any results.
2008-02-03 00:33 < MessedRawker> ok, so it'll only take like 35 years
2008-02-03 00:33 < rory096> MessedRawker: sweet let's do it then
2008-02-03 00:33 < quanticle> MessedRawker: It'd take only a couple seconds per sentence.
2008-02-03 00:33 < zero1328> 35 year x.x
2008-02-03 00:34 < MessedRawker> ok, 2 seconds
2008-02-03 00:34 < zero1328> So you're using a Commodore 128?
2008-02-03 00:34 * MessedRawker does more calculations
2008-02-03 00:34 < jeremyb> quanticle: this doesn't work if you're banned from google...
2008-02-03 00:34 < rory096> brb
2008-02-03 00:34 < quanticle> jeremyb: Don't worry. You'd max out your own internet connection before you were banned from google.
2008-02-03 00:35 < MessedRawker> ok, i have changed the number to 15 years
2008-02-03 00:35 < MessedRawker> assuming it is 2 seconds per sentence
2008-02-03 00:35 < quanticle> MessedRawker: Again. Parallelization is your friend.
2008-02-03 00:35 < MessedRawker> exactly!
2008-02-03 00:35 < MessedRawker> so say the bot is designed to handle three sentences at a time
2008-02-03 00:35 < MessedRawker> is that feasible? three sentences at a time?
2008-02-03 00:36 < quanticle> MessedRawker: Hand out copies of the bot to people and have them run it on their machines. It'd be like Folding@Home
2008-02-03 00:36 < MessedRawker> yes
2008-02-03 00:36 < MessedRawker> there can still be more than one way of parallelizing, though
2008-02-03 00:36 < jeremyb> quanticle: idk about that... also it'd be much better to just grab the first couple results and then grab more as needed then to grab 10 at a time. or even better to submit a batch of queries at once and batch the result processing
2008-02-03 00:36 < MessedRawker> doing multiple sentences at once, for example. is that feasible?
2008-02-03 00:37 * MessedRawker wonders where the channel went
2008-02-03 00:38 < jeremyb> MessedRawker: not sure you could realistically estimate where bottlenecks would be... you can just try it with a few machines and a prototype and go from there
2008-02-03 00:39 < MessedRawker> ok, jeremyb. but would it feasible for the bot to do three sentences at once?
2008-02-03 00:41 < MessedRawker> if it were, then that reduces it down to 5 years
2008-02-03 00:41 < jeremyb> MessedRawker: i don't know what you're asking...
2008-02-03 00:41 < jeremyb> MessedRawker: are we talking about google still or yahoo?
2008-02-03 00:41 < MessedRawker> jeremyb, if a single copy of the bot could launch three simultaneous checks
2008-02-03 00:41 < MessedRawker> and i am talking about yahoo
2008-02-03 00:41 < jeremyb> the bot could certainly be multithreaded
2008-02-03 00:41 * jeremyb looks at the yahoo API
2008-02-03 00:42 < MessedRawker> ok, anyways, that reduces the bot down to 5 years
2008-02-03 00:42 < MessedRawker> and if 10 people had a copy of the bot, that reduces it down to six months
2008-02-03 00:43 < MessedRawker> this just might be feasible after all
2008-02-03 00:43 < zero1328> get 30 people and get it down to 2 months
2008-02-03 00:44 < MessedRawker> would it be possible for me to set up 30 approved bot accounts, and then give the passwords to them out along with copies of the software?
2008-02-03 00:45 < jeremyb> i don't see why you'd need approved accounts for anything at all
2008-02-03 00:45 < MessedRawker> true. i suppose i could conduct the reporting outside of wikipedia
2008-02-03 00:45 < MessedRawker> because bot approval would be for if the bot had to do any editing on wikipedia
2008-02-03 00:45 < jeremyb> or you could have them all report to a master which then does the eits
2008-02-03 00:45 < MessedRawker> hey, even if it did, it wouldn't be necessarily required if all it did was edit its own page
2008-02-03 00:45 < jeremyb> edits*
2008-02-03 00:46 < MessedRawker> yes
2008-02-03 00:47 < MessedRawker> hmm, with 30 accounts it may take slightly longer than 2 months, since there will also be a step where the different clients have to report back to the master
2008-02-03 00:48 < MessedRawker> jeremyb, perchance, are you a programmer?
2008-02-03 00:49 < rory096> MessedRawker: not really. the bot would have to edit a reporting page anyway, so humans could check the pages, so each could be programmed to edit the same page, which wouldn't add an extra step but would keep all the information in one place
2008-02-03 00:50 < MessedRawker> the master bot has to keep track of the progress for one reason: to keep the list of articles to check up to date
2008-02-03 00:50 < rory096> true
2008-02-03 00:50 < MessedRawker> i thought of a system whereby the bot splits up the list into x lists depending on the amount of running clients
2008-02-03 00:50 < MessedRawker> but i thought of something even simpler
2008-02-03 00:50 < rory096> how about 26 bots, each with a letter of the alphabet or whatever, to keep it simple?
2008-02-03 00:51 < MessedRawker> once a client is done with an article, it requests the master for another article
2008-02-03 00:51 < rory096> that works too
2008-02-03 00:52 < rory096> though it could be a bit slower, since it needs to talk to the master every single time
2008-02-03 00:52 < MessedRawker> well, it's 2 seconds per sentence
2008-02-03 00:52 < MessedRawker> then after the article is done, a few more seconds for getting a new article
2008-02-03 00:52 < MessedRawker> so that averages to like
2008-02-03 00:53 < MessedRawker> 2.01 seconds
2008-02-03 00:53 < MessedRawker> or whatever
2008-02-03 00:53 < rory096> that's true
2008-02-03 00:53 < MessedRawker> the problem with working it so that there'd be 28 clients, where 26 are A-Z, one is 0-9, and one does weird symbol articles
2008-02-03 00:53 < MessedRawker> what happens if someone wants to run a 29th client
2008-02-03 00:54 < MessedRawker> we certainly shouldn't say "no" as a 29th client would speed up progress
2008-02-03 00:54 < MessedRawker> but then we'd have to divide up the list in a queer way
2008-02-03 00:54 < rory096> MessedRawker: you could split up the letters
2008-02-03 00:54 < rory096> so one gets R-Rm and the other gets Rm-Rz or whatever
2008-02-03 00:54 < MessedRawker> which brings me back to the first idea where the bot split the master list depending on the number of clients and then distributed that
2008-02-03 00:54 < MessedRawker> but that's too complicated
2008-02-03 00:55 < rory096> hmm
2008-02-03 00:55 < MessedRawker> it's easier for the client to go to the master and request a new article to work on
2008-02-03 00:55 < rory096> why not just send each client, say, 100 articles at a time, let it sift through that, and then ask for more?
2008-02-03 00:55 < MessedRawker> that will work too
2008-02-03 00:55 < triona> I don't see why it has to be particularly more complicated, just make it multithreaded
2008-02-03 00:56 < triona> you have a thread that pulls stuff into a queue from the master
2008-02-03 00:56 < triona> and a thread that actually does the work
2008-02-03 00:56 < MessedRawker> three threads to do the work, actually
2008-02-03 00:57 < MessedRawker> we don't want to make it so damn hyperthreaded that it requires a very expensive computer to run it
2008-02-03 00:57 < triona> then you only have to have queue sizes of about 5-10
2008-02-03 00:57 < jeremyb> MessedRawker: i am in fact
2008-02-03 00:58 < triona> a thread for talking to a coordinating master wouldn't be very expensive, it pretty much stays IO-bound all the time.
2008-02-03 00:58 < MessedRawker> anyways there'd be three different types of messages sent to the server: the "this sentence in this article is a copyvio" signal (enticing the bot to alert the internet), the "article is completely checked" signal (enticing the bot to delete the article from the list), and i "i need more articles" signal (guess what that does)
2008-02-03 00:58 < jeremyb> MessedRawker: many of these issues have been addressed in existing paralellism solutions
2008-02-03 00:59 < MessedRawker> triona, how many sentences could a client simultaneously check while not using way too many resources
2008-02-03 00:59 < jeremyb> MessedRawker: there's a big enough pool that it's prolly best to batch the assignments and then expire them if you don't hear back about a given page after a time out
2008-02-03 00:59 < triona> MessedRawker: probably a lot. you may need to be able to scale it according to load though
2008-02-03 01:00 < jeremyb> timeout*
2008-02-03 01:00 < MessedRawker> triona, would 10 sentences be good?
2008-02-03 01:01 * jeremyb thinks this discussion is pointless
2008-02-03 01:01 < MessedRawker> why
2008-02-03 01:01 < jeremyb> there's no way you could have accurate estimates at this point
2008-02-03 01:01 < jeremyb> just build a prototype already
2008-02-03 01:01 < MessedRawker> i can't program
2008-02-03 01:02 < jeremyb> so get someone too. that doesn't make your estimation any more useful
2008-02-03 01:02 * Gwern-away can :) but I'm not going to write it, even though it could be pretty elegant in Haskell
2008-02-03 01:02 * jeremyb heads back to the yahoo site
2008-02-03 01:02 * jeremyb chuckles at haskell
2008-02-03 01:02 * jeremyb can't remember what he knows that was in haskell
2008-02-03 01:03 < Gwern-away> jeremyb: do you disbelieve me? I have written a WP bot in Haskell which was quite elegant, check my user page
2008-02-03 01:03 < triona> MessedRawker: you also need to prioritize getting to articles early
2008-02-03 01:03 < jeremyb> Gwern-away: i just vaguely remember some app i'd heard of that used it. otherwise i know little of haskell
2008-02-03 01:04 < jeremyb> triona: huh?
2008-02-03 01:04 < triona> it's of more value to catch a copyvio before people are copying from *us*
2008-02-03 01:04 < triona> A lot of supposed copyvios are people copying wikipedia and not the other way around.
2008-02-03 01:05 < MessedRawker> triona, hence the human layer of course
2008-02-03 01:05 < Gwern-away> jeremyb: I'm particularly proud of this one: https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/User:Gwern/Archive-bot.hs
2008-02-03 01:05 < triona> So, if you catch them early - say within a few minutes of being added, you have a higher confidence that they really ARE copyvios
2008-02-03 01:05 < Gwern-away> it eats an xml dump, spiders the live WP article, and asks [[WebCite]] to back up external links - in a massively parallel fashion
2008-02-03 01:06 < rory096> triona: i think MessedRawker said before that where already has a new articles copyvio bot running
2008-02-03 01:06 < MessedRawker> rory096, except it doesn't run at the detail that my proposed bot will
2008-02-03 01:06 < Gwern-away> in what is about 6 lines, if you remove the redundancies I kept in for ease of modification and documentation :)
2008-02-03 01:06 < MessedRawker> my bot intends on checking every sentence
2008-02-03 01:06 < quanticle> jeremyb: Isn't xfwm written in Haskell?
2008-02-03 01:06 < rory096> MessedRawker: what does where's bot do?
2008-02-03 01:06 < MessedRawker> it checks like the first few sentences or something
2008-02-03 01:06 < jeremyb> quanticle: never heard of it
2008-02-03 01:06 < rory096> ah
2008-02-03 01:07 < Gwern-away> quanticle: xmonad
2008-02-03 01:07 < quanticle> jeremyb: jeremyb Its xmonad, rather
2008-02-03 01:07 < jeremyb> you can just have 2 seperate queues of articles
2008-02-03 01:07 < quanticle> jeremyb: Its a linux Window manager.
2008-02-03 01:07 < MessedRawker> yep
2008-02-03 01:08 < Gwern-away> not just linux. one of the dons uses openbsd - it's just wherever X
2008-02-03 01:08 < jeremyb> one for scanning dumps and one for new articles
2008-02-03 01:08 < triona> with the new articles at highest priority
2008-02-03 01:08 < Gwern-away> *it's useful for whereever X.org runs, which is on much more than linux
2008-02-03 01:08 < jeremyb> distribute big work packets for the dumps and small for the new
2008-02-03 01:08 < jeremyb> and timeout the new faster
2008-02-03 01:08 < jeremyb> then have slaves give priority to new and make it check for work in the new queue even if it still has work to do in the old queue
2008-02-03 01:09 < Gwern-away> nah, just have thousands of threads. if your runtime is decent, it should be able to handle it. heck, I have a good 2 or 3k python threads running now, and python isn't known for concurrency
2008-02-03 01:09 < triona> Need a target of perhaps 10 minutes total for "new" articles.
2008-02-03 01:09 < quanticle> gwern-true
2008-02-03 01:09 * quanticle goes to bed
2008-02-03 01:09 < quanticle> I can't type anymore
2008-02-03 01:10 < triona> The "old" queue woll shrink to nothing anyway if you have enough bots running, because the bots running the "new" queue won't let any copyvios through.
2008-02-03 01:10 < triona> will
2008-02-03 01:11 < Gwern-away> still find it hard to believe no bots are already running to do this task though
2008-02-03 01:12 < Nakon> Gwern-away: there is a copyvio bot
2008-02-03 01:12 < triona> I still find it hard to believe there are no bots running inline with the edit form to do a multitude of quality control tasks.
2008-02-03 01:12 < Gwern-away> Nakon: so why've everyone been discussing writing a new one?
2008-02-03 01:13 < Nakon> Gwern-away: dunno, maybe it doesn't do what others want it to do
2008-02-03 01:13 < triona> if we check grammar/spelling/style/external links inline with editing, and depending on the severity, either require the submission be fixed, or require the user to acknowledge warnings, we'd have a much better quality encyclopedia, and we'd make it a lot harder on vandals.
2008-02-03 01:14 * NCC-1701-E is playing the Wikipedia Rogue Admins Videogame
2008-02-03 01:14 < triona> most likely they'd get frustrated with the warnings: "ueensuooesoeus" is not a word.
2008-02-03 01:14 * Nakon thinks NCC-1701-E needs to find something better to do with his time
2008-02-03 01:14 < nokram> you mean the Wikipedia Rouge Admins Videogame
2008-02-03 01:15 < jeremyb> grrrr
2008-02-03 01:15 < jeremyb> *stabs* wifi
2008-02-03 01:15 < triona> Sentances need proper punctuation and capitalization.
2008-02-03 01:15 < triona> etc
2008-02-03 01:15 < rory096> they do?
2008-02-03 01:15 < nokram> they need proper spelling too
2008-02-03 01:15 < rory096> nonsense! ;)
2008-02-03 01:16 < Gwern-away> good luck internationlizing that... and I shudder to imagine the programmatic interface to such a filter
2008-02-03 01:16 < triona> Possible weasel phrase "is considered by some".
2008-02-03 01:16 < The359> Triona, that's a horrible idea
2008-02-03 01:16 < jeremyb> MessedRawker: so how do you determine where a sentence ends? just copy where's algo?
2008-02-03 01:16 < triona> Gwern-away: *nods* well, en would be a good start because of it's high exposure.
2008-02-03 01:16 < The359> Look how much people hate Clippy
2008-02-03 01:17 < MessedRawker> jeremyb, sure
2008-02-03 01:17 < IceSPRITE> hi
2008-02-03 01:17 < triona> The359: well, warning at page save wouldn't be quite like Clippy :)
2008-02-03 01:17 < The359> Yes it would
2008-02-03 01:17 < The359> It'd be an annoyance that would give false positives and get in the way
2008-02-03 01:18 * IceSPRITE I Find channels for punks and emothional people
2008-02-03 01:18 < IceSPRITE> :D
2008-02-03 01:18 < IceSPRITE> Say me please
2008-02-03 01:18 < Rinn> What about emotional punks?
2008-02-03 01:19 < The359> We have warning messages galore on picture uploads
2008-02-03 01:19 < The359> no one pays attention to them
2008-02-03 01:19 < triona> The359: I think the value of keeping harmful edits out outweighs that. Of course, you could probably give some users the ability to turn the warnings off.
2008-02-03 01:19 < The359> It wont stop harmful edits
2008-02-03 01:19 < Rinn> How often to people try to upload a picture of Goatse to [[Goatse]]?
2008-02-03 01:19 < IceSPRITE> Im russian punk and I find punk in U.Kingdom , America
2008-02-03 01:20 < Rinn> do, not to
2008-02-03 01:20 < triona> Also some of them could be "fatal" warnings for anon/unconfirmed.
2008-02-03 01:20 < triona> ie, adding links on an expanded version of the spam blacklist