freenode #wikipedia

2008-01-26 10:30 < Mike_H> What?
2008-01-26 10:30 < TheWeasel> Portsmouth are down against Plymouth.
2008-01-26 10:30 < TheWeasel> oh, never mind
2008-01-26 10:30 < TheWeasel> just a cheap anti-mathematicians shot.
2008-01-26 10:31 < TheWeasel> Are you saying they're unable to wait for an appropriate time unless they're somewhere formal?
2008-01-26 10:31 < Mike_H> not unable.
2008-01-26 10:32 < TheWeasel> that to me sounds like they need help beating instant gratification
2008-01-26 10:32 < Mike_H> It's a more professional atmosphere to actually talk about different things they've done, and the ramifications of doing such things.
2008-01-26 10:32 < TheWeasel> or maybe that's just me.
2008-01-26 10:32 < The_sunder_king> how the hell
2008-01-26 10:32 < TheWeasel> whatever
2008-01-26 10:32 < The_sunder_king> liverpool are now 2-1
2008-01-26 10:32 < TheWeasel> brb
2008-01-26 10:32 < Mike_H> "Whatever" is a very dismissive thing to say. I'm all for people "not getting it" but it's insulting to me to hear people not only not getting it but choosing not to get it.
2008-01-26 10:32 < Mike_H> I have to go anyway.
2008-01-26 10:33 < TheWeasel> whatever just meant I'm going to do something else now
2008-01-26 10:33 < Faroframkallande> The_sunder_king: wrong way around
2008-01-26 10:33 < TheWeasel> so I can't go on
2008-01-26 10:33 < The_sunder_king> nope
2008-01-26 10:33 < The_sunder_king> http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/l/liverpool/live_text/default.stm
2008-01-26 10:34 < TheWeasel> I think many sides in this are not getting it.
2008-01-26 10:34 < arcimboldo_> oh - it's 2 AGAINST liverpool
2008-01-26 10:34 < The_sunder_king> yeah
2008-01-26 10:34 < The_sunder_king> that's what I meant
2008-01-26 10:35 < The_sunder_king> its not fair, as soon as H&W took the lead all the betting websites cut down the odds
2008-01-26 10:36 < Faroframkallande> The_sunder_king: duh
2008-01-26 10:36 < The_sunder_king> You can't do that though, its pretty unfair and "cheating"
2008-01-26 10:37 < Faroframkallande> if a team is winning, it stands to reason they have a better chance of winning than if they were losing or drawing
2008-01-26 10:38 < The_sunder_king> ok
2008-01-26 10:40 < Faroframkallande> thus the odds should be cut
2008-01-26 10:41 < TheWeasel> but they can't change the promised odds on the bets already placed.
2008-01-26 10:41 < TheWeasel> so if you had the vision, you win.
2008-01-26 10:41 < The_sunder_king> yeah that's why I find it unfair
2008-01-26 10:41 < TheWeasel> or if you know what kind of sports car Itandje would like.
2008-01-26 10:42 * TheWeasel sees betting manipulation everywhere
2008-01-26 10:42 < The_sunder_king> it originally started off at 100/1
2008-01-26 10:42 < The_sunder_king> when it went to 1-0, it went to 21-1
2008-01-26 10:42 < The_sunder_king> when it went to 2-1, it went to 16/1
2008-01-26 10:43 < arcimboldo_> That's still a lot, considering that they're in the lead close to half-time.
2008-01-26 10:43 < TheWeasel> the closer to the end, the easier the prediction, the worse the quote.
2008-01-26 10:44 < arcimboldo_> Hm ...
2008-01-26 10:45 < arcimboldo_> Life would be so simple if you could beat simple logic ...
2008-01-26 10:47 < arcimboldo_> 2-2 ...
2008-01-26 10:47 < The_sunder_king> damn
2008-01-26 10:47 < The_sunder_king> H&W have 51% of possesion mind
2008-01-26 10:47 < arcimboldo_> Well, perhaps you now get better than 16/1 ...
2008-01-26 10:47 < The_sunder_king> heh
2008-01-26 10:50 < TheWeasel> should get rich SAFELY
2008-01-26 10:50 < TheWeasel> Portsmouth is back.
2008-01-26 10:51 < The_sunder_king> I didn't bet anything
2008-01-26 10:51 < The_sunder_king> basically I was just reading what it said on the BBC
2008-01-26 10:54 * Faroframkallande is watching the ending of Army of Ghosts
2008-01-26 10:54 < Faroframkallande> the last fourty seconds are epic
2008-01-26 10:54 * TheWeasel tries to remember the biggest upset he's ever witnessed (besides Bayern going out of the cup against fourth-class sides a couple of times)
2008-01-26 10:55 < TheWeasel> Tsonga's victory on Thursday certainly comes close.
2008-01-26 10:56 < TheWeasel> that was astonishing
2008-01-26 10:58 < TheWeasel> Perhaps it was Bulgaria's win over Germany in '94
2008-01-26 10:58 < datura> hi
2008-01-26 10:59 < arcimboldo_> Well ... Germany-Algeria 1-2 in '82 was worse than that.
2008-01-26 10:59 < TheWeasel> I wasn't around then
2008-01-26 10:59 < TheWeasel> Germany once nearly drew with the Faroe Islands
2008-01-26 10:59 < arcimboldo_> And Cordoba '78 ...
2008-01-26 10:59 < TheWeasel> all before my time.
2008-01-26 11:00 < arcimboldo_> They once managed to qualify for a World or European Cup by a 2-1 home victory against Malta in the 89th minute ...
2008-01-26 11:00 < TheWeasel> In history, I've never seen anything quite like Senegal's win against France in 2002.
2008-01-26 11:00 < TheWeasel> heh yea.
2008-01-26 11:01 < TheWeasel> But Austria has lost on the Faroes
2008-01-26 11:01 < TheWeasel> and 8-1 or something against Spain
2008-01-26 11:04 < TheWeasel> heh, and then there was the "European final with the lowest attendance in history"
2008-01-26 11:04 < TheWeasel> in the late 70s, in Dusseldorf I believe
2008-01-26 11:05 < TheWeasel> no 1981
2008-01-26 11:05 < geniice> OMG it's full of buzzwords
2008-01-26 11:05 < geniice> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transformation_design
2008-01-26 11:05 < TheWeasel> Tbilisi v Carl Zeiss Jena
2008-01-26 11:05 < arcimboldo_> oh ... it seems it was Albania not Malta.
2008-01-26 11:07 < TheWeasel> geniice: Does it have enough proactive, quality leverage to provide excellence for complete customer satisfaction?
2008-01-26 11:07 * arcimboldo_ watched the Bayer Uerdingen against Dynamo Dresden UEFA cup match ... Dresden had won 2-0 at home and had a 3-1 lead at halftime in Uerdingen. The end result was 7-3 for Uerdingen.
2008-01-26 11:07 < TheWeasel> haha
2008-01-26 11:08 < geniice> TheWeasel no http://maschmeyer.blogspot.com/2008/01/i-am-wikied-therefore-i-am-wikipedia.html
2008-01-26 11:08 < TheWeasel> Pete Doherty of Babyshambles and gossip press fame was born near Krefeld and is trying to help the bankrupt club
2008-01-26 11:09 < TheWeasel> Brr
2008-01-26 11:09 < arcimboldo_> Anyhow - I'll stop the bragging for tonight ... need to be in time for the Sumo tomorrow ....
2008-01-26 11:10 < TheWeasel> cheers.
2008-01-26 11:10 < TheWeasel> oh, it's a system theory approach to Everything (tm)
2008-01-26 11:11 < TheWeasel> it's still a bit weird
2008-01-26 11:11 < TheWeasel> the article
2008-01-26 11:11 < TheWeasel> shifting between chummy and colorful and abstract and empty
2008-01-26 11:28 * Messedrocker spins at a remarkably high velocity
2008-01-26 11:28 * Cyrius harnesses Messedrocker as a clean source of energy
2008-01-26 11:29 * Messedrocker spins at a remarkably high velocity into a giant turtle and watches as he rolls around on his back
2008-01-26 11:29 * Messedrocker notes the choir coming in
2008-01-26 11:33 < NotACow> Messedrocker: don't let any elephants stand on your back
2008-01-26 11:33 < NotACow> THE TURTLE MOVES
2008-01-26 11:36 < TheWeasel> I hate websites that don't color-mark already visited links
2008-01-26 11:36 < lti> me too
2008-01-26 11:38 < NotACow> DEATH TO EVIL WEBSITES
2008-01-26 11:38 < TheWeasel> this one isn't evil, it just doesn't like me.
2008-01-26 11:38 < Messedrocker> <website> You suck, TheWeasel!
2008-01-26 11:38 < Scarian> Does anyone know of any hard drive partioning software?
2008-01-26 11:39 < Messedrocker> fdisk!
2008-01-26 11:39 < NotACow> oh, well, that's different. you DESERVE to be punished. :)
2008-01-26 11:39 < NotACow> Scarian: fdisk works well
2008-01-26 11:39 < Leslie_S> I prefer cfdisk on linux.
2008-01-26 11:39 < Scarian> NotACow: How much is that?
2008-01-26 11:39 < Leslie_S> Partition Magic is really good if you need to resize, but make sure you defrag any windows partitions first...
2008-01-26 11:39 < Scarian> Leslie_S: Is it absolutely necessary to defrag?
2008-01-26 11:40 < Messedrocker> Ninji!
2008-01-26 11:40 < Leslie_S> Scarian yes, if you want to resize partitions without destroying data.
2008-01-26 11:40 < Leslie_S> Scarian partition magic can usually resize without losing any data whatsoever, but you should always back up before doing anything like that...its dangerous.
2008-01-26 11:40 < Leslie_S> Scarian it costs money of course, but...its good.
2008-01-26 11:40 < Scarian> Leslie_S: Basically... I want to create a partition to put my important files on... then I'm going to install Vista... but I don't want to lose my data...
2008-01-26 11:41 < Scarian> Will I have to defrag then?
2008-01-26 11:41 < Messedrocker> hammer-ON!
2008-01-26 11:42 < Messedrocker> apply directly to the forehead
2008-01-26 11:42 < CTho> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Image-Turkish_Airlines_Flight_981.jpg does "permission: see below" mean there should be evidence of permission somewhere on this page?
2008-01-26 11:42 < Leslie_S> Scarian its not like defragging is hard or anything. its infact something that should be done extremely regularly...
2008-01-26 11:42 < TheWeasel> yes
2008-01-26 11:42 < Messedrocker> especially on windows
2008-01-26 11:43 < Scarian> Leslie_S: Okay, thank you. I'll have a look at the prog. Cheers :)
2008-01-26 11:43 * Messedrocker doesn't see a defrag feature on his mac-in-tosh; assumes macs don't need defragmentation
2008-01-26 11:43 < Leslie_S> Scarian but youre using a potentially dangerous method to backup data....note that you would need to back up the data before doing this anyway! get a cheap external hard drive or a big flash drive...
2008-01-26 11:43 < Leslie_S> thats your best bet
2008-01-26 11:43 < Leslie_S> Messedrocker is it OS X?
2008-01-26 11:43 < Leslie_S> or newre?
2008-01-26 11:43 < Messedrocker> Mac OS X 10.5
2008-01-26 11:44 < Leslie_S> Messedrocker it shouldnt need defragmentation theoretically, it's essentially a unix distribution...
2008-01-26 11:44 < Messedrocker> it is
2008-01-26 11:44 < Leslie_S> *nix since i dont know what exactly its made of :P
2008-01-26 11:44 < Messedrocker> mac os x is based on darwin, which is based on BSD, which is based on UNIX
2008-01-26 11:45 < Leslie_S> ah. bsd.
2008-01-26 11:45 < Messedrocker> darwin's some dumpy operating system NeXT made
2008-01-26 11:45 < CTho> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Trulystand700 wow, the uploader has lots of images with problems
2008-01-26 11:46 < Scarian> On a totally unrelated question...
2008-01-26 11:46 < Scarian> Can people bring aerosols onto planes?
2008-01-26 11:46 < Scarian> i.e. in luggage
2008-01-26 11:46 < Messedrocker> hmmm
2008-01-26 11:46 < Messedrocker> i guess if they're small enough
2008-01-26 11:46 < CTho> Scarian: http://www.tsa.gov/travelers/airtravel/prohibited/permitted-prohibited-items.shtm
2008-01-26 11:47 < Scarian> Messedrocker: In terms of ml?
2008-01-26 11:47 < CTho> you can bring 3oz aerosols as carryon
2008-01-26 11:47 < CTho> so you can bring your anthrax distributor or whatever ;)
2008-01-26 11:47 < lti> me too
2008-01-26 11:47 < Scarian> CTho: How'd you find that so fast?
2008-01-26 11:47 < Leslie_S> WOOT, finally got tax documentation for my unemployment in the mail!
2008-01-26 11:47 < CTho> Scarian: i googled tsa aerosol
2008-01-26 11:47 < CTho> and it's the first result
2008-01-26 11:47 < Scarian> CTho: Clever :D
2008-01-26 11:47 < Scarian> 3oz?
2008-01-26 11:47 < Scarian> What's that in metric?
2008-01-26 11:47 < CTho> 88 ml
2008-01-26 11:48 < Scarian> Aw damn...
2008-01-26 11:48 < CTho> http://www.google.com/search?q=3oz+in+ml
2008-01-26 11:48 < Scarian> Looks like I won't be smelling of Old Spice :-?
2008-01-26 11:48 < Scarian> :/
2008-01-26 11:48 < CTho> well, you can probably have a bigger container in your checked luggage
2008-01-26 11:49 < Scarian> CTho: Does British Airways have the same requirements do you think?
2008-01-26 11:49 < CTho> Scarian: it's not up to the airlinei f they're flying through the US
2008-01-26 11:49 < CTho> if you're not flying through paranoialand, you'd have to find guidelines from somewhere else
2008-01-26 11:49 < Scarian> CTho: Well... I just wanna smell good without breaking any laws to be honest... :/
2008-01-26 11:50 < TheWeasel> The worst pickle would be if they outlawed stinking in public at the same time.
2008-01-26 11:50 < Scarian> I would be awfully upset...
2008-01-26 11:51 < CTho> you can take regular deodorant sticks... it's easy not to stink in public
2008-01-26 11:51 < Scarian> CTho: Would roll-on deodrant apply to those same restrictions?
2008-01-26 11:51 < CTho> beats me
2008-01-26 11:52 < Scarian> Aw man... it's like they WANT people to notice how much you sweat/smell...
2008-01-26 11:52 < Scarian> |:-|
2008-01-26 11:52 < CTho> http://www.google.com/search?q=tsa+roll-on+deodorant looks like roll-on is a problem
2008-01-26 11:52 < Messedrocker> dick on a tree.
2008-01-26 11:52 < Messedrocker> deltree the TSA!
2008-01-26 11:53 < quanticle> Messedrocker: Surely you mean rm -rf /TSA*
2008-01-26 11:54 < Scarian> CTho: Why are the restrictions so tight?
2008-01-26 11:54 < TheWeasel> Roll-on, roll-off cargo traffic
2008-01-26 11:54 < CTho> Scarian: because they have to make americans feel like things are being done to protect them from the evil terrrrrrorirsts that are all around
2008-01-26 11:55 < CTho> also know as security theater http://www.google.com/search?q=tsa+%22security+theater%22
2008-01-26 11:55 < Scarian> CTho: You're not even allowed a proper tubes worth of toothpaste!
2008-01-26 11:55 < CTho> yup
2008-01-26 11:55 < quanticle> CTho: Heh. Its becauses terrorists might bring "liquid explosives" and mix them in the bathroom.
2008-01-26 11:55 < CTho> I've wanted to put this on a shirt for a flight: http://ctho.ath.cx/tmp/political_cartoon_MP_2005_07_25.gif
2008-01-26 11:56 < Scarian> quanticle: You can make explosives from roll on deodrant and toothpaste?
2008-01-26 11:56 < Scarian> That makes so much sense!
2008-01-26 11:57 < quanticle> Scarian: According to the TSA, you could probably make explosives from your own spit and piss.
2008-01-26 11:57 * quanticle is disgusted with the new flight regulations...
2008-01-26 11:57 * Scarian no longer wants to produce saliva just in case he blows himself up...
2008-01-26 11:57 * quanticle will have to take a long plane trip soon...
2008-01-26 11:57 * Scarian will remove his bladder before he gets on the plane... just in case...
2008-01-26 11:59 < Scarian> http://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2006/11/tsa_security_ro_1.html
2008-01-26 11:59 < Scarian> One of those stories in there is hilarious
2008-01-26 11:59 < CTho> ooh, a rubber band ball
2008-01-26 12:00 < Scarian> No, no... read the spaghetti one :D
2008-01-26 12:01 < Messedrocker> mike crapo!!
2008-01-26 12:02 < quanticle> Scarian: Heh. So all the "terrorists" have to do is freeze their "liquid explosives", and everything'll be kosher! TSA I <3 you so much right now...
2008-01-26 12:02 < CTho> haha nice :)
2008-01-26 12:02 < Scarian> "It's not a liquid right now," he observantly noted. "But it will be soon."
2008-01-26 12:02 < Scarian> haha... oh man...
2008-01-26 12:02 < Messedrocker> next we need to try to get Samus Aran on an airplane
2008-01-26 12:02 < Leslie_S> hahaha
2008-01-26 12:02 < Messedrocker> <TSA> Ma'am, please take off your Varia Suit.
2008-01-26 12:03 < Messedrocker> * Samus shoots the TSA officer
2008-01-26 12:03 < quanticle> Messedrocker: Well, Samus has her own private plane (or spacecraft, rather), so she doesn't need to bother with TSA checks.
2008-01-26 12:03 < Scarian> Is the TSA basically in charge of air port security in the US?
2008-01-26 12:03 < Messedrocker> True
2008-01-26 12:03 < Messedrocker> yes Scarian
2008-01-26 12:04 < Scarian> They're not particularly intelligent.
2008-01-26 12:04 < Scarian> ...if I'm honest.
2008-01-26 12:04 < quanticle> Scarian: Yeah. Theoretically they're also in charge of port security, but not really because the US doesn't really have any port security to speak of.
2008-01-26 12:04 < quanticle> And by 'port', I mean seaport.
2008-01-26 12:04 * Scarian could drive a boat into the US with plenty of spit and piss then...
2008-01-26 12:07 < quanticle> Yeah. You could also probably drive a boat into the US with a nuke, and no one would notice, or care.
2008-01-26 12:07 < quanticle> Its funny, because containers are only inspected at the time of unloading. If there's a nuke in the container, and you're trying to inspect it at the port, you're already too late...
2008-01-26 12:08 < quanticle> If the nuke goes off, it'll still devastate the city...
2008-01-26 12:09 < Scarian> quanticle: It is quite ridiculous...
2008-01-26 12:09 * Scarian sighs.
2008-01-26 12:10 < Scarian> Unrelated question...
2008-01-26 12:10 < Scarian> Is Toronto on the east coast of Canada?
2008-01-26 12:11 < TheWeasel> no
2008-01-26 12:11 < Scarian> Mid canada?
2008-01-26 12:11 < TheWeasel> Although it's sort of hard to define "east coast of Canada"
2008-01-26 12:12 < TheWeasel> it's not the easternmost part but it could be further east than in the middle I'd say.
2008-01-26 12:12 < TheWeasel> not sure
2008-01-26 12:14 < Scarian> Hmm... okay. Thanks.
2008-01-26 12:19 < Scarian> Okay I have socks!
2008-01-26 12:19 < Scarian> (sock puppets)
2008-01-26 12:19 < Scarian> And not me personally...
2008-01-26 12:19 < Scarian> I found someone who does...
2008-01-26 12:19 * Scarian digs a hole...
2008-01-26 12:19 < TheWeasel> Oh, I was about to suggest you rock them.
2008-01-26 12:20 < Scarian> TheWeasel: I'm more concerned with how badly I worded that :D
2008-01-26 12:20 < TheWeasel> :-)
2008-01-26 12:23 < Messedrocker> bah
2008-01-26 12:23 < Messedrocker> i cannot find an old ac adapter
2008-01-26 12:35 < Drunken_Idiot> Hi
2008-01-26 12:48 < Scarian> Leslie_S: Okay I'm partioning now.
2008-01-26 13:01 < Fabexplosive> hello
2008-01-26 13:37 * geniice considers if private eye can be considered a reliable source on certian areas of EU funding
2008-01-26 13:56 < McLoaf> Holger Höglund fanclub!
2008-01-26 13:56 < McLoaf> ...just kidding
2008-01-26 13:57 < geniice> it appears we are now to blame for terrorism
2008-01-26 13:57 < geniice> I thought 10000 votes were required to remove the pictures of Prophet Mohammed (PBUH, but as far as I can see they have reached 45536 and the pictures are still displayed. I think neglecting the will of this number of free Muslims has many implications which I don't like to mention, mostly that 1 billion Muslims do not have the power 15 million Jews have. I'm not anti-semitist, Arabs are...
2008-01-26 13:57 < geniice> ...semitists themselves, but I'm trying to tell you people at Wikipedia that by neglecting our fair demands you are increasing hatered amongst Muslims towards every Western thing,and then you can't complain of terrorism. As a civilized Arab I'm asking you to be reasonable enough to meet our fair demands in order to reach out to each other, East and West.
2008-01-26 13:58 < geniice> http://www.thepetitionsite.com/2/removal-of-the-pics-of-muhammad-from-wikipedia
2008-01-26 14:02 < gwern> deliberately degrading the quality of our encyclopedia is not a fair demand
2008-01-26 14:04 * autocracy sighs
2008-01-26 14:04 < autocracy> tolerance is far too lacking in the world
2008-01-26 14:08 < TheWeasel> Are they threatening us?
2008-01-26 14:08 < TheWeasel> like "I don't want anything bad to happen, but I can't guarantee anything, either..."
2008-01-26 14:09 < TheWeasel> is that about the Danish cartoons?
2008-01-26 14:09 < TheWeasel> the funny thing is that Wikipedia is what you want it to be, not Western at all.
2008-01-26 14:10 < Ryan_wp> Good afternoon (for me) everyone.
2008-01-26 14:10 < lti> That's a rather broad generalization
2008-01-26 14:11 < NotACow> moo
2008-01-26 14:12 < Ryan_wp> I though you weren't a cow :)
2008-01-26 14:12 < TheWeasel> generalizations are hard to avoid when others define things too narrowly.
2008-01-26 14:12 < TheWeasel> "10,000 votes were required?"
2008-01-26 14:13 < TheWeasel> Where?
2008-01-26 14:13 < TheWeasel> that is an odd concept
2008-01-26 14:13 < autocracy> the goal o the petition was 10,000.... somebody's putting the idea in their own head that one person's goal for that petition is something that wikipedia will act on
2008-01-26 14:14 < TheWeasel> I wouldn't display the cartoons, myself, a) they're copyrighted and b) they're bad
2008-01-26 14:14 < Random832> [[test]]
2008-01-26 14:14 < TheWeasel> but then trying to muzzle someone this way is kind of odd
2008-01-26 14:14 < Random832> [[test]] [[test]]
2008-01-26 14:15 < Random832> [[test]] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/test
2008-01-26 14:15 < Random832> test: bug 0000
2008-01-26 14:15 < geniice> TheWeasel wikipedia claims fair use on the cartoons
2008-01-26 14:15 < Random832> [[test]] [[1234]]
2008-01-26 14:15 < SpeedEvil> Hello! Is there an easy way to find which edit a phrase of an article was introduced?
2008-01-26 14:15 < TheWeasel> It claims fair use on far too many things.
2008-01-26 14:15 < jeremyb> Random832?
2008-01-26 14:15 < geniice> SpeedEvil no
2008-01-26 14:15 < TheWeasel> it's a bad development
2008-01-26 14:16 < Lobster> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:Please_leave_this_line_alone_%28sandbox_heading%29
2008-01-26 14:16 < SpeedEvil> geniice: Thanks.
2008-01-26 14:16 < mavhc> I like the way that 15 million jews created the cartoons
2008-01-26 14:16 < Lobster> could a non-admin visit this page?
2008-01-26 14:16 < Lobster> is it protected for you?
2008-01-26 14:16 < TheWeasel> there are 15 million Jews?
2008-01-26 14:16 < Random832> [[test]] [[test2]]
2008-01-26 14:16 < Random832> [[test]] [[test2]]
2008-01-26 14:16 < mavhc> there aren't a lot of jews, considering the amount of news coverage they get
2008-01-26 14:16 < Ryan_wp> Random832: What are you doing?
2008-01-26 14:16 < Random832> jeremyb: i'm testing a wiki link script
2008-01-26 14:16 < jeremyb> Lobster: yes but i'm an anon atm
2008-01-26 14:16 < Lobster> ah :p
2008-01-26 14:16 < Ryan_wp> oh, nevermind
2008-01-26 14:16 < TheWeasel> Coincidence? Osama Bin Laden thinks not.
2008-01-26 14:16 < lti> hm
2008-01-26 14:17 < mavhc> either they're always getting in trouble or there's some kind of conspiracy in the media
2008-01-26 14:17 < Random832> test: bug 123 r456
2008-01-26 14:17 < Lobster> any "established" user logged in able to check?
2008-01-26 14:17 < TheWeasel> well, Jewish people were never socially allowed to be working class in western countries.
2008-01-26 14:17 < Random832> test: bug 123 http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=123
2008-01-26 14:17 < TheWeasel> so they ended up elsewhere
2008-01-26 14:17 < Random832> test [[test]] [[test]]
2008-01-26 14:17 < Random832> test: bug 123 <http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=123>
2008-01-26 14:18 < TheWeasel> ...
2008-01-26 14:18 < Lobster> these tests have to be in #wikipedia why?
2008-01-26 14:18 < Random832> test [[test]] <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/test>
2008-01-26 14:18 < jeremyb> they don't
2008-01-26 14:18 < Random832> that's odd, it's filtering duplicates for wiki links but not for bugzilla links
2008-01-26 14:18 < lti> It is indeed
2008-01-26 14:18 < Random832> sorry, i'm done now
2008-01-26 14:18 < Lobster> :) :P
2008-01-26 14:19 < Lobster> you can make up for it and tell me if you can edit http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:Please_leave_this_line_alone_%28sandbox_heading%29
2008-01-26 14:19 < Random832> why?
2008-01-26 14:19 < jeremyb> ok, ok, i'll log in
2008-01-26 14:19 < TheWeasel> Please leave this loner aligned.
2008-01-26 14:19 < Random832> i.e. what edit do you want made
2008-01-26 14:19 < TheWeasel> Please line this lover alight.
2008-01-26 14:20 < Lobster> i've been registered for years, have >2500 edits, but i'm getting the semi-protected notice when i view the source
2008-01-26 14:20 * SpeedEvil waves.
2008-01-26 14:20 < jeremyb> *sigh*
2008-01-26 14:20 < jeremyb> ar: temporary file: No space left on device
2008-01-26 14:20 < Random832> it's fully protected
2008-01-26 14:20 < jeremyb> make[6]: *** [libgklayout.a] Error 1
2008-01-26 14:20 < Random832> you're getting the semi-protected notice?
2008-01-26 14:20 < Lobster> yeah :/
2008-01-26 14:20 < Lobster> try viewing the source
2008-01-26 14:20 < TheWeasel> I AM A RESPECTED MEMBUH
2008-01-26 14:20 < Random832> can't, i'm an admin - hold on, i'll switch logins
2008-01-26 14:20 < TheWeasel> brb
2008-01-26 14:21 < jeremyb> Lobster: i'm getting semi-protect as anon too
2008-01-26 14:21 < Lobster> admin with sockpupper :O
2008-01-26 14:22 < MessedRawker> is it possible to config the BIOS with an operating system loaded?
2008-01-26 14:22 < lti> think so
2008-01-26 14:22 < jeremyb> there are some utils that can
2008-01-26 14:22 < MessedRawker> any for windows vista?
2008-01-26 14:22 < jeremyb> of course it depends on the BIOS in question i think
2008-01-26 14:22 < jeremyb> probably
2008-01-26 14:23 < MessedRawker> basically, i am dealing with a laptop with a broken display. i can only use function-F4 with the already-installed OS, Windows Vista, as when I try to boot from a CD function-F4 absolutely does not work
2008-01-26 14:23 < jeremyb> i think most of them are either live cds/floppies/etc. that then have full control of the system
2008-01-26 14:23 < Ryan_wp> I just looked at a page to copy some code. I didn't have a problem doing that, but I couldn't edit it (if I wanted to), even though it was only semi-protected. I've been an editor for two years! Is there a problem with a server or something like that?
2008-01-26 14:23 < jeremyb> *or*
2008-01-26 14:23 < MessedRawker> so what I want to know is if configuring the BIOS to disregard the built-in display will work
2008-01-26 14:23 < mavhc> there's sometimes apps to config the bios entries, but they're seperate from the bios config screen
2008-01-26 14:23 < Lobster> okay guys i just tried some other semi'ed pages
2008-01-26 14:23 < Lobster> i think somebody broke semi-protection
2008-01-26 14:23 < jeremyb> they are utils made specifically for a given BIOS by/for manufacturer
2008-01-26 14:23 < Random832> eh?
2008-01-26 14:23 < lti> I used to live in Canada, and they don't actually say "eh" that much, did you know?
2008-01-26 14:24 < mavhc> basically an entirely other interface to the same cmos ram, or flash ram now
2008-01-26 14:24 < Ryan_wp> Hmm...
2008-01-26 14:24 < MessedRawker> i do know that :)
2008-01-26 14:24 < Random832> the sandbox header is fully protected pages - do other fully protcted pages do the semi notice?
2008-01-26 14:24 < Random832> [and what do you mean broke semi-protection - can anons edit semi'd pages?]
2008-01-26 14:24 < Lobster> no
2008-01-26 14:24 < Lobster> other way round
2008-01-26 14:24 < Lobster> registered users can't
2008-01-26 14:24 < Aqwis> :D
2008-01-26 14:24 < Lobster> or they've increased the registration threshold to at least two years
2008-01-26 14:24 < Ryan_wp> uh oh...
2008-01-26 14:24 < Aqwis> feature, tbh ;)
2008-01-26 14:25 * Lobster slaps Aqwis around a bit with a large trout
2008-01-26 14:25 < Ryan_wp> I've been an editor for two years, so I guess it may be more.
2008-01-26 14:25 < Lobster> yeah? yesterday it was two days, i believe
2008-01-26 14:25 < Lobster> a rather unprecedented change :P
2008-01-26 14:26 < MessedRawker> you know how on a laptop you can do function-F4 to utilize a different display?
2008-01-26 14:26 < Lobster> MessedRawker: the key configuration is up to the laptop manufacturer, but on principle, yes
2008-01-26 14:26 < MessedRawker> is that feature specific to an operating system or to the hardware?
2008-01-26 14:26 < MessedRawker> i.e. it'd work in any OS?
2008-01-26 14:27 < Ryan_wp> MessedRawker:At least for HP (that's what I'm using right now)
2008-01-26 14:27 < MessedRawker> i'm dealing with an HP laptop too
2008-01-26 14:27 < MessedRawker> HP Pavilion something-or-other with a broken display
2008-01-26 14:27 < jeremyb> Lobster: yeah it still says semi and i still can't edit and i'm older than 4 days/20 edits/whatever it is
2008-01-26 14:27 < lti> me too
2008-01-26 14:27 < Lobster> it's 4 days, just checked the policy
2008-01-26 14:27 < Lobster> is there a dev noticeboard?
2008-01-26 14:27 < jeremyb> Lobster: #wikimedia-tech
2008-01-26 14:27 < MessedRawker> Ryan_wp, is the function-F4 feature specific to the operating system or to the laptop hardware/firmware?
2008-01-26 14:27 < jeremyb> doesn't matter what the policy is
2008-01-26 14:28 < jeremyb> i said "whatever it is"
2008-01-26 14:28 < jeremyb> :-)
2008-01-26 14:28 < lti> me too
2008-01-26 14:28 < Lobster> MessedRawker: it's OS-dependent
2008-01-26 14:28 < Eltran> I like blanking wikipedia a lot
2008-01-26 14:28 < MessedRawker> ok
2008-01-26 14:28 < Eltran> it's so much fun.
2008-01-26 14:28 < MessedRawker> Lobster, is it possible to configure the BIOS to use another screen instead of the built-in display?
2008-01-26 14:29 < jeremyb> MessedRawker: specific to the BIOS if it's marked on the keyboard that came with it
2008-01-26 14:29 < MessedRawker> yeah it is
2008-01-26 14:29 < MessedRawker> there's a monitor symbol on the F4 key
2008-01-26 14:29 < Lobster> jeremyb: i don't think that's the case
2008-01-26 14:29 < jeremyb> sounds familiar
2008-01-26 14:29 < jeremyb> Lobster: certainly is
2008-01-26 14:29 < Lobster> how does the OS know about the change then?
2008-01-26 14:30 < jeremyb> BIOS tells it?
2008-01-26 14:30 < jeremyb> err
2008-01-26 14:30 < jeremyb> not quite BIOS but something lower level than OS i think...
2008-01-26 14:30 < jeremyb> don't know the architecture well enough at that level
2008-01-26 14:30 * jeremyb looks it up
2008-01-26 14:31 < MessedRawker> jeremyb, is it possible to configure the BIOS to use another screen instead of the built-in display?
2008-01-26 14:31 < Ryan_wp> I don't really know actually, I was just making an educated guess about the HP part. I've only seen the function F4 on HP laptops.
2008-01-26 14:32 < Lobster> it wouldn't be quite that simple MessedRawker; the selection of output display is dependent on what's available from the graphics card
2008-01-26 14:32 < jeremyb> MessedRawker: likely... how do you see the BIOS though?
2008-01-26 14:32 < MessedRawker> jeremyb, hence my original question, "can you access the BIOS from the operating system"
2008-01-26 14:33 < jeremyb> (with a busted screen)
2008-01-26 14:33 < jeremyb> ahh
2008-01-26 14:33 < Lobster> usually pressing delete or tab as soon as the pc starts to boot enters the bios config screen
2008-01-26 14:33 < jeremyb> never heard of tab
2008-01-26 14:34 < jeremyb> usually del or f1/f2 i think
2008-01-26 14:34 < Ryan_wp> That was odd... My connection was reset. That's never happened before
2008-01-26 14:34 < jeremyb> *never*?!
2008-01-26 14:35 * jeremyb wonders if he believes it
2008-01-26 14:35 < Ryan_wp> No, never happened to me
2008-01-26 14:35 < jeremyb> MessedRawker: care to provide model/manufacturer?
2008-01-26 14:35 < MessedRawker> HP
2008-01-26 14:35 < MessedRawker> hold up
2008-01-26 14:37 < MessedRawker> HP Pavilion dv2000
2008-01-26 14:37 < MessedRawker> it's a laptop
2008-01-26 14:38 < Ryan_wp> I have an HP Pavilion dv6000, if that helps at all.
2008-01-26 14:38 < Scarian> What's the preprocessor?
2008-01-26 14:39 < Messedrocker> hell if i know
2008-01-26 14:39 < Ryan_wp> Is there a way to determine that by the system information?
2008-01-26 14:39 < Messedrocker> before i muck around with trying to access the BIOS, i want to know if you can even configure which display to use through BIOS
2008-01-26 14:39 < lti> What happened afterwards?
2008-01-26 14:39 < Lobster> Scarian: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Preprocessor
2008-01-26 14:40 < Scarian> Lobster: Thanks for the link...
2008-01-26 14:40 * Scarian has no idea what it means...
2008-01-26 14:40 < Scarian> Lobster: What does it do for Wikipedia exactly?
2008-01-26 14:42 < Lobster> Scarian: i think the preprocessor would transclude wikipedia templates
2008-01-26 14:42 < Lobster> do you have a context though?
2008-01-26 14:42 < Scarian> e.g. go to your watchlist...
2008-01-26 14:42 < Scarian> you'll see the note at the top
2008-01-26 14:42 < Ionas_Freeman> hi
2008-01-26 14:43 < Lobster> wow
2008-01-26 14:43 < Lobster> that's horribly presumptuous about the level of technical knowledge of wikipedia editors
2008-01-26 14:43 < Scarian> Lobster: That's what I was thinking...
2008-01-26 14:43 * jeremyb looks at the list at http://h20180.www2.hp.com/apps/Lookup?h_query=Pavilion+dv2000 and pokes Messedrocker
2008-01-26 14:44 < Messedrocker> i don't know which one mine is
2008-01-26 14:44 < Lobster> yeah, whatever it functionally does, it's a portion of the code that leads to retrieving pages for people
2008-01-26 14:44 < lti> me too
2008-01-26 14:44 < Lobster> so i suppose they made it more efficient somehow and want to know if it broke
2008-01-26 14:44 < Ionas_Freeman> I am damn upset that Jdforrester has decided to proclaim himself the whole committee and "declined to unban you". You're not afraid, James, just intimidating me.
2008-01-26 14:45 < Lobster> oh, Scarian: the link the notice provides http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Migration_to_the_new_preprocessor gives a little more explanation
2008-01-26 14:45 * jeremyb points to http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/genericDocument?docname=c00033108&dlc=en&lc=en&cc=us and pokes Messedrocker
2008-01-26 14:46 < Messedrocker> wait, why are we looking for the exact model number?
2008-01-26 14:46 < Scarian> Lobster: I am awful at understanding that stuff... so I assume pages will load faster or something? :|
2008-01-26 14:46 < Luigi30> lame
2008-01-26 14:46 < Luigi30> I bought a Tandy 102 for $5 and the ROM is dead
2008-01-26 14:46 < jeremyb> Messedrocker: i figure it's better to grab the manual for your model than just picking one from the list at random
2008-01-26 14:46 < Ionas_Freeman> I would like to make an arbitration case, and until http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Requests_for_arbitration/Ionas68224 is no longer a redlink, I will be talking here.
2008-01-26 14:47 < Lobster> Scarian: yeah
2008-01-26 14:48 < Ionas_Freeman> Can someone please initiate this case, and unban me for the time being to participate in arbcom case
2008-01-26 14:48 < Ionas_Freeman> ?
2008-01-26 14:50 < Random832> Ionas_Freeman: write your statement, list of parties, etc, and e-mail me. If the case is *accepted*, you will be unblocked.
2008-01-26 14:50 < Ionas_Freeman> Random832: ok, my email is disabled, so what's yours? (mine: joeyyuan@cox.net
2008-01-26 14:51 < Random832> special:emailuser is disabled for you?
2008-01-26 14:51 < Ionas_Freeman> no, email blocked
2008-01-26 14:51 < jeremyb> Lobster: http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:Ionas68224&action=edit says protect not semi
2008-01-26 14:51 < Random832> just put it together offline; I'll ask an arb about unprotecting your talk page when you say you have it ready
2008-01-26 14:52 < Ionas_Freeman> who do I email?
2008-01-26 14:52 < Random832> just write up the case and tell me on IRC when it's ready
2008-01-26 14:52 < Ionas_Freeman> alright.
2008-01-26 14:52 < jeremyb> Lobster: oh now that other page does too
2008-01-26 14:52 < Lobster> jeremyb: they are both fully protected
2008-01-26 14:53 < Lobster> see the "why isn't this page more specific?" notice at the bottom
2008-01-26 14:53 < Lobster> appears to be a problem with the new preprocessor we were talking about a minute ago
2008-01-26 14:53 < jeremyb> okey
2008-01-26 14:53 < jeremyb> so who changed the message?
2008-01-26 14:54 < Random832> jeremyb: that was me
2008-01-26 14:54 < Random832> i had to change it because it was just saying "this page is semi-protected" all the time before
2008-01-26 14:54 < jeremyb> Random832: yeah, i just saw with Lobster's pointer to why isn't this message more specific?
2008-01-26 14:55 < jeremyb> i thought Random832 was just a nick you picked for the day
2008-01-26 14:55 < Random832> heh
2008-01-26 14:55 < Random832> no
2008-01-26 14:55 < Random832> this is my usual screenname
2008-01-26 14:55 < Ionas_Freeman> Now, what does my "statement" say?
2008-01-26 14:56 < jeremyb> that's up to you
2008-01-26 14:56 < jeremyb> typedef Random832 predictable
2008-01-26 14:56 < Random832> look at other arbcom cases to see what's typically in a statement i guess
2008-01-26 14:58 < Ryan_wp> Darn, my battery went dead. It would help to turn on the switch to the outlet, don't you think?
2008-01-26 14:58 < Random832> Ryan_wp: i've done that before - it sucks
2008-01-26 15:01 < PovAddict> what's the template name for 'citation needed'?
2008-01-26 15:01 < jeremyb> {{fact}} ?
2008-01-26 15:02 < jeremyb> whoa
2008-01-26 15:02 < Ryan_wp> That was interesting... I understand about 0.00000001% of it
2008-01-26 15:02 < jeremyb> i understand all of it
2008-01-26 15:03 < Ryan_wp> good for you :)
2008-01-26 15:03 < Falc> :O
2008-01-26 15:03 < jeremyb> i don't understand where dircbot came from though
2008-01-26 15:03 < jeremyb> don't remember him being here a few months ago
2008-01-26 15:03 < Master_son> its recent
2008-01-26 15:04 < Master_son> [[m:IRC bots/dircbot]]
2008-01-26 15:05 < jeremyb> Master_son: that just describes operation
2008-01-26 15:05 < jeremyb> dircbot ping
2008-01-26 15:05 < jeremyb> !ping
2008-01-26 15:07 < Mike2> http://worldofwonder.net/images4/rambochardlatimes.jpg
2008-01-26 15:07 < James_F> Ionas_Freeman> We've already discussed your case. Sorry that we didn't reply to your e-mail before your on-wiki prompt.
2008-01-26 15:08 < jeremyb> James_F: you be arbcom?
2008-01-26 15:09 < CMoreschi> he is indeed
2008-01-26 15:09 < James_F> jeremyb> I'm one of the members of the Committee, yes. See [[w:User:Jdforrester]].
2008-01-26 15:09 < CMoreschi> and a whole load of other very grand things, too
2008-01-26 15:09 < Ryan_wp_away> I'll be right back (configuring chatzilla scripts)
2008-01-26 15:10 < Faroframkallande> Mike2: Jack Bauer is more badass
2008-01-26 15:10 < Doc_glasgow> jeremyb: James_F is an ancient wikigod - an incarnation of cabal
2008-01-26 15:10 < Doc_glasgow> He walks amongst us
2008-01-26 15:10 < James_F> Hardly. I'm just a lowly grunt who's been over-promoted. :-)
2008-01-26 15:11 < Mike2> Bauer's got nothing on Sly
2008-01-26 15:11 < jeremyb> i thought there was no cabal?!
2008-01-26 15:11 < Doc_glasgow> but James, the triumph of mediocrity IS the embodied spirit of wikipedia
2008-01-26 15:11 < jeremyb> James_F: reading...
2008-01-26 15:11 < James_F> Doc_glasgow> Don't channel Larry too much. :-)
2008-01-26 15:12 < spectie> <Doc_glasgow> but James, the triumph of mediocrity IS the embodied spirit of wikipedia
2008-01-26 15:12 < spectie> haha
2008-01-26 15:12 * jeremyb thought who was it...
2008-01-26 15:12 < morwen> hello peoples
2008-01-26 15:12 < CMoreschi> James_F: ooh, one quick word: I don't know if arbitrators watchlist cases they've closed, but if a few of you chaps could keep an eye on http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Requests_for_arbitration/Macedonia#Log_of_blocks_and_bans , that would be much appreciated. Just so I don't go overboard, hmm?
2008-01-26 15:12 < jeremyb> who's the sysop that's also an oper here?
2008-01-26 15:12 < lti> hm?
2008-01-26 15:12 < morwen> i don't suppose there is anyone here who has an near-encyclopedic knowledge of SF
2008-01-26 15:12 < Doc_glasgow> as in Sci-Fi or San Fran?
2008-01-26 15:12 < jeremyb> sean whitton maybe
2008-01-26 15:13 < jeremyb> yeah i think so
2008-01-26 15:13 < morwen> sci-fi
2008-01-26 15:13 * jeremyb thought he was the group contact dude
2008-01-26 15:13 < Sniperz11> is there an active MILHIST member here
2008-01-26 15:13 < Ryan_wp> [[test]] Just testing a new script
2008-01-26 15:13 < Ryan_wp> okay, it works. Good!
2008-01-26 15:14 < jeremyb> "My computer is generally permanently connected to about two dozen channels, but I'm not actually at my machine permanently. Honest." do people find that hard to believe?
2008-01-26 15:14 < Messedrocker> my computer used to be like that
2008-01-26 15:14 < James_F> CMoreschi> I watchlist all case pages, but I don't watch my watchlist very often.
2008-01-26 15:14 < Doc_glasgow> jeremyb: no
2008-01-26 15:14 < jeremyb> Ryan_wp: don't tell me Random832 infected you
2008-01-26 15:14 < Random832> lol
2008-01-26 15:14 < Random832> (for context - i was doing script testing about half an hour ago)
2008-01-26 15:16 < jeremyb> dircbot: get it overwith already!
2008-01-26 15:17 * jeremyb wonders why James_F has seperate licensing for gov entities and why he uses cc-by instead of cc-by-sa
2008-01-26 15:18 < Shiroi_Neko> jeremyb cc-by is less restrictive
2008-01-26 15:19 < jeremyb> Shiroi_Neko: yes i noticed that. it doesn't require you to sa
2008-01-26 15:19 < Shiroi_Neko> no attribution requirement
2008-01-26 15:19 < Shiroi_Neko> it is like pd just more free
2008-01-26 15:19 < James_F> jeremyb> Not for Government entries; it's an image licence for the US State maps, which I created with Anome.
2008-01-26 15:20 < Shiroi_Neko> James_F was a federal employee?
2008-01-26 15:20 < Shiroi_Neko> cute
2008-01-26 15:20 < James_F> And I don't agree with the ShareAlike principle.
2008-01-26 15:20 < jeremyb> Shiroi_Neko: huh?!
2008-01-26 15:20 < Messedrocker> federal?
2008-01-26 15:20 < Shiroi_Neko> James_F is a fed
2008-01-26 15:20 < Shiroi_Neko> :P
2008-01-26 15:20 < James_F> I'm not employed by the US government. :-)
2008-01-26 15:20 < Random832> Shiroi_Neko: eh? cc-by has an attribution requirement - and pd does not.
2008-01-26 15:20 < jeremyb> Random832++
2008-01-26 15:20 * jeremyb was too slow
2008-01-26 15:20 < James_F> Random832> In the EU, PD is equivalent to cc-by.
2008-01-26 15:20 < Shiroi_Neko> cc-by does not have an attribution requirement
2008-01-26 15:20 < Shiroi_Neko> thats cc-by-sa
2008-01-26 15:20 < James_F> Shiroi_Neko> It does. That's what the "-by" bit means.
2008-01-26 15:20 < morwen> it does too
2008-01-26 15:20 < morwen> that's what the -by part is
2008-01-26 15:20 < Random832> James_F: then it's not really PD.
2008-01-26 15:21 < morwen> please check your facts before posting nonsense to irc
2008-01-26 15:21 < Random832> and - europe has "moral rights" that you can't give up, but that's not really part of copyright is it?
2008-01-26 15:21 < Shiroi_Neko> hmmm
2008-01-26 15:21 < Random832> Shiroi_Neko: "by" = attribution, "sa" = share alike
2008-01-26 15:21 < Shiroi_Neko> morwen please cease being a dick
2008-01-26 15:21 < morwen> [otherwise how can you be sure its nonsense?]
2008-01-26 15:21 < Shiroi_Neko> :P
2008-01-26 15:21 < Shiroi_Neko> Random832 ah right
2008-01-26 15:21 < Random832> (and don't moral rights also prevent some modification?)
2008-01-26 15:21 < James_F> Random832> Yes it is. The moral right is equivalent to attribution, except that it lasts forever. There are secondary moral rights about "appropriate use of work" that aren't Europe-wide, but only in some jurisdictions.
2008-01-26 15:22 < Shiroi_Neko> cc standalone was no attribution requirement
2008-01-26 15:22 < Shiroi_Neko> James_F cc is more free than pd because pdness can be overuled with a change in law
2008-01-26 15:22 < lti> Not that much more
2008-01-26 15:22 < Shiroi_Neko> age of life+70 can be extended for example
2008-01-26 15:22 < James_F> Shiroi_Neko> As could CC. And I don't think the Berne Convention is going anywhere.
2008-01-26 15:23 < Shiroi_Neko> BC doesnt limit to 70 years
2008-01-26 15:23 < Random832> James_F: i thought though that it was different from copyright, and that wikipedia doesn't worry about it like it doesn't worry about trademark
2008-01-26 15:23 < James_F> And anyway, EU citiziens probably (*) can't licence their content as PD.
2008-01-26 15:23 < James_F> So it's irrelevent to me.
2008-01-26 15:23 < Shiroi_Neko> BC actualy has a 50 years or more restriction
2008-01-26 15:23 < Shiroi_Neko> James_F I like using every free license
2008-01-26 15:23 < Random832> i.e. there's a copyright interest and a moral rights interest and they overlap but are distinct
2008-01-26 15:24 < Shiroi_Neko> James_F can I revoke GFDL and pake it PD?
2008-01-26 15:24 < Shiroi_Neko> *make
2008-01-26 15:25 < James_F> Shiroi_Neko> Good question. Arguably open licences are intended to be irrevokable.
2008-01-26 15:25 * James_F shrugs.
2008-01-26 15:25 < Shiroi_Neko> James_F what if I dont want attribution anymore
2008-01-26 15:25 < Shiroi_Neko> :P
2008-01-26 15:25 * Shiroi_Neko sues gfdl
2008-01-26 15:25 < James_F> I'm not a lawyer, I just play one on Wikimedia IRC. :-)
2008-01-26 15:25 * Shiroi_Neko plays with James_F
2008-01-26 15:28 < shimgray> don't some free licenses have a clause allowing you to prevent a downstream reuser from attributing you?
2008-01-26 15:28 < shimgray> (say, if your material is being reused as part of a political tract you wish no association with)
2008-01-26 15:28 < Shiroi_Neko> shimgray arent you both a democrat and republican? :P
2008-01-26 15:29 < Random832> shimgray: i vaguely remember a discussion on the debian mailing list about such a license, i think the conclusion was that it's non-free
2008-01-26 15:29 < shimgray> I am most certainly no stripe of republican, thank*you*
2008-01-26 15:29 < Doc_glasgow> God save the Queen
2008-01-26 15:29 < shimgray> Random832: why? you're not preventing them *using* it, just a caveat to your preferred method of attribution
2008-01-26 15:30 < shimgray> I mean, it wouldn't really be an unfree license to say "attribute me as X, unless it's online, where please attribute me with a link to Y if possible"
2008-01-26 15:30 < Random832> shimgray: such a clause prevents unmodified distribution of previous versions that contained attribution
2008-01-26 15:31 < shimgray> I don't see how it would.
2008-01-26 15:31 < Random832> requiring a particular kind of attribution is not the same as forbidding all kinds of attribution
2008-01-26 15:31 < Doc_glasgow> when I say Queen, I mean Queen Hillary, of course
2008-01-26 15:31 < Random832> since adding something can be done with an extra thing tacked on
2008-01-26 15:32 < Random832> whereas having to go through and remove all places their name is mentioned is an unacceptable burden
2008-01-26 15:32 < Random832> this was how the argument went on the debian MLs anyway
2008-01-26 15:35 < Shiroi_Neko> Doc_glasgow god save her soul
2008-01-26 15:36 < Shiroi_Neko> Doc_glasgow
2008-01-26 15:36 < Doc_glasgow> I am sure he will
2008-01-26 15:36 < Shiroi_Neko> in the anime bleach souls are saved through the use of a zampaktou
2008-01-26 15:36 < Shiroi_Neko> which basicaly is a sword
2008-01-26 15:36 < Shiroi_Neko> the contaminated soul is purified by cutting
2008-01-26 15:37 < Shiroi_Neko> seems like a good idea