freenode #wikipedia

2008-01-10 13:06 * Cometstyles coughs *perv* coughs*
2008-01-10 13:07 * Ceiling_Cat huggles Cometstyles
2008-01-10 13:07 * Cometstyles huggles Ceiling_Cat :)
2008-01-10 13:08 < Gracenotes> *can't use /me on Telnet*
2008-01-10 13:08 * Cometstyles kicks effeietsanders
2008-01-10 13:08 * Cometstyles runs !!
2008-01-10 13:08 < IceKarma> Gracenotes, sure you can.
2008-01-10 13:09 < Gracenotes> no, I can't write out a \u001
2008-01-10 13:09 * effeietsanders slaps Cometstyles with a rotten herring
2008-01-10 13:09 < IceKarma> Gracenotes, and Ctrl+A won't produce one for you?
2008-01-10 13:09 < Gracenotes> no
2008-01-10 13:09 < Cometstyles> ooh fish atack O_o
2008-01-10 13:09 < Gracenotes> I'm actually using a Java telnet emulator I wrote
2008-01-10 13:09 < White_Cat> Gracenotes yes
2008-01-10 13:10 < IceKarma> Gracenotes. {{sofixit}} :P
2008-01-10 13:10 < Gracenotes> so it's not strictly terminal
2008-01-10 13:10 < White_Cat> thats why you do NOT telnet
2008-01-10 13:10 < IceKarma> Gracenotes, or just get a better TELNET client :P
2008-01-10 13:10 < Gracenotes> IceKarma: there are no other telnet clients
2008-01-10 13:10 < Gracenotes> school. can't download .exes
2008-01-10 13:10 < White_Cat> Oh Lord, forgive Gracenotes and his lack of the /me command. Amen!
2008-01-10 13:10 < Gracenotes> *can use asterisks*
2008-01-10 13:11 < White_Cat> *** Gracenotes ***
2008-01-10 13:11 < Gracenotes> then again, I use this "telnet" client exclusively for IRC
2008-01-10 13:11 < Gracenotes> I could just make it into an IRC client with some adjustments
2008-01-10 13:11 < Formentar> Gracenotes: So that rules out tunneling your browser through ssh, I suppose. And using some form of VPN. What about booting from a USB stick?
2008-01-10 13:11 < White_Cat> G******tes
2008-01-10 13:12 < Gracenotes> Formentar: USB is firewalled unless scanned
2008-01-10 13:12 < Gracenotes> and scanning certainly would turn up an .exe
2008-01-10 13:12 < White_Cat> G*********
2008-01-10 13:13 < Gracenotes> ssh, maybe, if I used my home computer to do it
2008-01-10 13:13 < Gracenotes> but I can connect to freenode's servers -- port 8001 -- just not have a decent client
2008-01-10 13:13 < Formentar> Gracenotes: Firewalled? Scanning? I'm talking about sticking it in at boot and bypass Windows entirely. But I'm sure they've thought of that. :-/
2008-01-10 13:13 < White_Cat> Gracenotes just use mirc
2008-01-10 13:13 < Gracenotes> *impales White_Cat*
2008-01-10 13:14 < White_Cat> what did I do?
2008-01-10 13:14 < Formentar> Oohh, a cat on a stick! *We'll have dinner tonight, kids!*
2008-01-10 13:14 < Gracenotes> Formentar: hm... this is Novell running Windows, actually. I don't think I can get a net connection without connecting to the school intranet
2008-01-10 13:14 < White_Cat> sure you can
2008-01-10 13:14 < White_Cat> http proxies
2008-01-10 13:14 < White_Cat> like your-freedom
2008-01-10 13:14 < Formentar> Gracenotes: Sounds like an evil place. :-o
2008-01-10 13:14 < White_Cat> or httptunnel
2008-01-10 13:14 < Gracenotes> Formentar: glad you noticed :P
2008-01-10 13:14 < White_Cat> I can get through governmental firewalls with that
2008-01-10 13:14 < Gracenotes> it's only a high school
2008-01-10 13:15 < White_Cat> Gracenotes why would you go to a high school
2008-01-10 13:15 < Gracenotes> White_Cat: but you can't get through my heart! :'(
2008-01-10 13:15 < White_Cat> aside from the free sex and political scandal
2008-01-10 13:15 < Gracenotes> White_Cat: because I'm required by law
2008-01-10 13:15 * Formentar laughs.
2008-01-10 13:15 < White_Cat> Gracenotes like you obey the law consistently
2008-01-10 13:15 < Formentar> (Out, but not very Loud)
2008-01-10 13:16 < Gracenotes> White_Cat: well, I would like to go to college
2008-01-10 13:16 < Gracenotes> especially since low-skill jobs are being outsourced
2008-01-10 13:16 < White_Cat> Gracenotes bypass HS with exams
2008-01-10 13:16 < Tony_Sidaway> I would like a collage. Or perhaps a bricollage.
2008-01-10 13:16 < Formentar> ...but what with being expelled for IRCing and all...
2008-01-10 13:16 < Gracenotes> lol
2008-01-10 13:16 < Gracenotes> it's a Java project
2008-01-10 13:16 < IceKarma> Tony_Sidaway, *bricolage?
2008-01-10 13:16 < Gracenotes> I wrote this emulator in swing
2008-01-10 13:16 < White_Cat> Tony_Sidaway you cant attend a college
2008-01-10 13:16 < Formentar> Tony_Sidaway: Will a collagen injection do?
2008-01-10 13:16 < White_Cat> you'll scare all the vandals away
2008-01-10 13:17 < Gracenotes> White_Cat: bypassing not possible in the US, that I know of
2008-01-10 13:17 < White_Cat> Gracenotes sure it is
2008-01-10 13:17 < Gracenotes> you could get out when you're 16
2008-01-10 13:17 < White_Cat> people graduate from HS early
2008-01-10 13:17 < White_Cat> YES
2008-01-10 13:17 < Tony_Sidaway> Attend? College used to be my full time occupation. I left because the remuneration was not enough to raise a family on.
2008-01-10 13:17 < White_Cat> thats 2+ years
2008-01-10 13:17 < Gracenotes> but without a GED equivalent
2008-01-10 13:17 < White_Cat> Tony_Sidaway well
2008-01-10 13:18 < White_Cat> so you teach in a college
2008-01-10 13:18 < White_Cat> boy
2008-01-10 13:18 < White_Cat> Oh boy!
2008-01-10 13:18 < White_Cat> mmmm
2008-01-10 13:18 * Formentar makes sure to obey the network policy at his university. Being new to the country and sharing an office with four women might have something to do with it.
2008-01-10 13:18 < White_Cat> Tony_Sidaway have you heard of the Quantum Leap Project?
2008-01-10 13:18 < Gracenotes> *meows like a kitty*
2008-01-10 13:19 < Floor_Feline> *meeeeoooowwwww*
2008-01-10 13:19 * Formentar tramples Floor_Feline.
2008-01-10 13:19 < Tony_Sidaway> White_Cat: the one where this guy looks in the mirror to see if he's wearing a dress?
2008-01-10 13:19 < Floor_Feline> *just wants to masturbate without anyone watching him*
2008-01-10 13:19 < Tony_Sidaway> I got a bit confused about that one. In the end he turned into a space captain with an amusing dog.
2008-01-10 13:20 < Floor_Feline> well, anyway
2008-01-10 13:20 < quanticle> Floor_Feline: I don't think Ceiling_Cat is on.
2008-01-10 13:20 < Floor_Feline> adieu, all
2008-01-10 13:20 < bumm13> that's not Raul anyway, it's Gracenotes
2008-01-10 13:20 < Floor_Feline> bell just rang, now to economics
2008-01-10 13:20 < White_Cat> Tony_Sidaway thats sort of the idea
2008-01-10 13:20 < White_Cat> cross dressing
2008-01-10 13:21 < quanticle> Formentar: How does having 4 women in your office affect your obeyance of network policy?
2008-01-10 13:21 < White_Cat> in one case he was only wearing a diper
2008-01-10 13:21 < Formentar> quanticle: no pr0n.
2008-01-10 13:21 < White_Cat> granted he leaped into a chip
2008-01-10 13:21 < White_Cat> *chimp
2008-01-10 13:21 < Tony_Sidaway> The dog should have worn a goldfish bowl helmet like Snowy in Tintin's space adventure.
2008-01-10 13:21 < quanticle> Formentar: Ah. I wasn't thinking of that. I was going more for the "no hacking" side of things
2008-01-10 13:22 < quanticle> Tony_Sidaway, White_Cat: What on earth are you two going on about?
2008-01-10 13:22 < White_Cat> Tony_Sidaway sad that not a single quantum leap episode is article worthy
2008-01-10 13:22 < White_Cat> quanticle Quantum Leap
2008-01-10 13:22 * White_Cat traps quanticle into the imaging chamber
2008-01-10 13:22 < quanticle> White_Cat: That show is the distillation of the '80s
2008-01-10 13:22 < Formentar> quanticle: Not that I would otherwise. But there are borderline cases. Like http://kitnkayboodle.comicgenesis.com/
2008-01-10 13:22 < bumm13> Formentar: so you'd look at porn at the office if it was just male coworkers? :P
2008-01-10 13:22 < Tony_Sidaway> quanticle: he wouldn't know if he was a woman this week until he looked in the mirror.
2008-01-10 13:22 < bumm13> ah
2008-01-10 13:22 < White_Cat> quanticle 80's?
2008-01-10 13:22 < Tony_Sidaway> Or a chimp. presumably
2008-01-10 13:23 < White_Cat> or a man
2008-01-10 13:23 < White_Cat> or a murderer
2008-01-10 13:23 < White_Cat> or a cop
2008-01-10 13:23 < Formentar> bumm13: Nah, but I might make them watch 2girls1cup...
2008-01-10 13:23 < White_Cat> or an undercover cop that is cross dressing
2008-01-10 13:23 < quanticle> White_Cat: Wasn't Quantum Leap the show which used incredibly cheesy special effects and everyone had crazy '80s hair?
2008-01-10 13:23 < Tony_Sidaway> He had an invisible friend.
2008-01-10 13:23 < White_Cat> 26 March, 1989 – 5 May, 1993
2008-01-10 13:24 < Tony_Sidaway> Was it really the 1980s?
2008-01-10 13:24 < White_Cat> it ran from 1989-1993
2008-01-10 13:24 < White_Cat> it was the 90's
2008-01-10 13:24 < Tony_Sidaway> ah well, near enough 1980s.
2008-01-10 13:24 < White_Cat> it had taken place in the past for the most part
2008-01-10 13:24 < White_Cat> 80's was the lost generation
2008-01-10 13:24 < Tony_Sidaway> It was still the 1980s until that guy from Nirvana killed himself
2008-01-10 13:24 < quanticle> White_Cat: Well, hmmm. I always thought that it fit more into the '80s because of its visual style, even though the majority of the show wasn't in the '80s.
2008-01-10 13:24 < Ceiling_Cat> Kurt Cobain
2008-01-10 13:24 < The359> That guy from Nirvana?
2008-01-10 13:25 < White_Cat> The359 he just reached nirvana
2008-01-10 13:25 * The359 stabs Tony_Sidaway
2008-01-10 13:25 < quanticle> The359: Yes, "that guy from Nirvana"
2008-01-10 13:25 * Ceiling_Cat snickers
2008-01-10 13:25 < quanticle> Nirvana is overrated
2008-01-10 13:25 < Tony_Sidaway> Yes, Kurt Cobain. The entire 1990s and most of the naughties has basically been Kurt's wake. All those jangly guitar bands!
2008-01-10 13:25 * bumm13 stabs quanticle
2008-01-10 13:25 < Ceiling_Cat> bumm13 - don't forget to steal his innocence first
2008-01-10 13:25 < bumm13> ok
2008-01-10 13:26 < bumm13> quanticle: and what music do you listen to?
2008-01-10 13:26 < White_Cat> Tony_Sidaway have you ever thout of leaping into oher peoples personalities like in the show
2008-01-10 13:26 < The359> There are no innocents
2008-01-10 13:26 < White_Cat> boy I wouldnt want to leap into the Ceiling_Cat
2008-01-10 13:26 < White_Cat> Man!
2008-01-10 13:26 < Tony_Sidaway> My son played a Kurt Cobain song to me the other day. I knew it very well.
2008-01-10 13:26 < Tony_Sidaway> It was an old David Bowie song from 1970.
2008-01-10 13:26 < Tony_Sidaway> The Man Who Sold The World
2008-01-10 13:26 < White_Cat> Tony_Sidaway you mean bush?
2008-01-10 13:26 < quanticle> bumm13: Whatever Pandora selects for me, generally...
2008-01-10 13:26 < The359> that was one of Cobain's favorite songs
2008-01-10 13:27 < Tony_Sidaway> Yeah, I heard Kurt's version. Not bad.
2008-01-10 13:27 < bumm13> quanticle: so The Chipmunks? :)
2008-01-10 13:27 < White_Cat> Volare!
2008-01-10 13:27 < Tony_Sidaway> I've still got the Bowie album somewhere on vinyl,.
2008-01-10 13:27 < White_Cat> Oh! Oh! Oh!
2008-01-10 13:27 < quanticle> bumm13: Not really. Try again...
2008-01-10 13:28 < White_Cat> Cantare! Oh, oh, oh, oh!
2008-01-10 13:28 < White_Cat> Tony_Sidaway have you ever heard Volare sung live?
2008-01-10 13:28 < White_Cat> aside from on TV
2008-01-10 13:29 < White_Cat> like that Eurovision
2008-01-10 13:29 < bumm13> Emerson Lake and Palmer
2008-01-10 13:29 < White_Cat> 1958 Eurovision #3rd
2008-01-10 13:30 < bumm13> hiya wmarsh
2008-01-10 13:30 < wmarsh> hello bumm13
2008-01-10 13:30 < Ceiling_Cat> Greetings wmarsh. We have been expecting you
2008-01-10 13:30 < wmarsh> mmhmm
2008-01-10 13:30 < quanticle> bumm13: If you really wanted to find out, you could just look up quanticle@gmail.com on Pandora
2008-01-10 13:31 < White_Cat> Tony_Sidaway can I call you Al?
2008-01-10 13:31 < bumm13> oh, I thought you meant Pandora in a metaphorical sense :P
2008-01-10 13:32 < tawker> quanticle: email addresses on pandora?
2008-01-10 13:32 * tawker has to vpn to get access to pandora (stupid dmca)
2008-01-10 13:32 < quanticle> tawker: Well that's how I log in
2008-01-10 13:32 < quanticle> tawker: Why do you need to VPN in order to stay compliant with DMCA?
2008-01-10 13:32 < White_Cat> Tony_Sidaway can I?
2008-01-10 13:32 < Ceiling_Cat> tawker - you could have at least made a dirty joke about pandora's box ;)
2008-01-10 13:32 < Ceiling_Cat> ahem, "box"
2008-01-10 13:32 < tawker> quanticle: because Pandora blocks to Canada
2008-01-10 13:33 < quanticle> tawker: Oh. I see
2008-01-10 13:33 < tawker> pandora's box of DRM has been opened
2008-01-10 13:33 < tawker> the sad thing was, I actually bought music I listened to on Pandora directly
2008-01-10 13:33 < tawker> above and beyond the stupid "blank media" taxes we have in Canada
2008-01-10 13:34 < bumm13> (ugh, Flash interface)
2008-01-10 13:36 < bumm13> heya Demi
2008-01-10 13:37 < Demi> hi bumm13
2008-01-10 13:37 < TheWeasel> In mathematics, the Entscheidungsproblem (German for 'decision problem') is a challenge posed by David Hilbert in 1928. The Entscheidungsproblem asks for a computer program that will take as input a description of a formal language and a mathematical statement in the language and return as output either "True" or "False" according to whether the statement is true or false.
2008-01-10 13:37 < TheWeasel> Hilbert asked for a computer program?
2008-01-10 13:38 < bumm13> heh
2008-01-10 13:38 < bumm13> I don't recall any true all-electronic computers existing in 1928
2008-01-10 13:38 < TheWeasel> none did
2008-01-10 13:38 < bumm13> exactly :-)
2008-01-10 13:38 < TheWeasel> so, wtf?
2008-01-10 13:38 < TheWeasel> too damn many programmers on here
2008-01-10 13:39 * Ceiling_Cat deprograms TheWeasel
2008-01-10 13:39 < TheWeasel> :-)
2008-01-10 13:41 * bumm13 thinks this Pandora site interface sucks balls
2008-01-10 13:42 < quanticle> TheWeasel: Hilbert asked for an algorithm
2008-01-10 13:42 < TheWeasel> there you go
2008-01-10 13:42 < Drunken_Idiot> Hi
2008-01-10 13:42 < quanticle> TheWeasel: It was Turing that brought computers into it
2008-01-10 13:42 < Drunken_Idiot> Hello quanticle and TheWeasel
2008-01-10 13:42 < TheWeasel> yep
2008-01-10 13:42 < TheWeasel> brb
2008-01-10 13:42 < quanticle> TheWeasel: Hel called them Turing machines, but we all know what he menat
2008-01-10 13:42 < quanticle> *meant
2008-01-10 13:42 < Ceiling_Cat> bumm13 - in 1928, there were harvard bessel funciton generators
2008-01-10 13:42 < bumm13> :)
2008-01-10 13:43 < Drunken_Idiot> Hi Ceiling_Cat and bumm13
2008-01-10 13:43 < Ceiling_Cat> but those are generally not considered "computers" because they were not reprogrammable
2008-01-10 13:43 < quanticle> Hello Drunken_Idiot
2008-01-10 13:43 < bumm13> and Hollerith punch-card tabulators :)
2008-01-10 13:43 < Ceiling_Cat> they could only run one function
2008-01-10 13:43 < zocky> stupid google claims that 50 miles per gallon = 21.2571853 kilometers per liter
2008-01-10 13:43 < Drunken_Idiot> Hya zockster
2008-01-10 13:43 < zocky> when in fact it's 4.7 liters per 100 km :)
2008-01-10 13:43 < quanticle> zocky: Is that wrong?
2008-01-10 13:43 < Tony_Sidaway> If I recall correctly, Hilbert's question wasn't formulated in terms of an automaton, but Turing's answer was.
2008-01-10 13:43 < Ceiling_Cat> zocky - I don't understand those crazy metric measurements. Can you pleaes express that in burning libraries of congress per second?
2008-01-10 13:44 < zocky> quanticle, it's correct, arithmetically, but it's still useless for a european trying to figure out how much fuel a car burns
2008-01-10 13:44 < quanticle> Tony_Sidaway: You recall correctly.
2008-01-10 13:44 < Demi> i can never tell how long something is until i know how many of them it would require to stack to the moon
2008-01-10 13:44 * TheWeasel performs at 281 permille per fortnight
2008-01-10 13:44 < bumm13> zocky: it appears that answer is correct
2008-01-10 13:45 < quanticle> Tony_Sidaway: Alonzo Church did it with lambda calculus
2008-01-10 13:45 < bumm13> ah, silly 100 km
2008-01-10 13:45 < Tony_Sidaway> there is a problem in computer science, the stopping problem, that I believe is related to Hilbert's.
2008-01-10 13:45 < Tony_Sidaway> It has a similar negative answer.
2008-01-10 13:45 < Ceiling_Cat> Tony - it's called the halting problem
2008-01-10 13:45 < bumm13> yay "metric point-of-view" :P
2008-01-10 13:45 < Ceiling_Cat> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halting_problem
2008-01-10 13:45 < Tony_Sidaway> A universal turing machine cannot predict the stopping of another utm.
2008-01-10 13:45 < Demi> "stopping" is the metric term for the imperial "halting"
2008-01-10 13:45 < Ceiling_Cat> see the history section in our article
2008-01-10 13:46 * Ceiling_Cat lulz @ Demi
2008-01-10 13:46 < TheWeasel> It's funny how far they were in mathematics and at the same time how backwards in chemistry
2008-01-10 13:46 * Drunken_Idiot hugs Demi
2008-01-10 13:46 < bumm13> Americans have long understood how decimal-style fractions are evil ;)
2008-01-10 13:46 < TheWeasel> Ernst Mach didn't believe in atoms around 1930.
2008-01-10 13:46 < Tony_Sidaway> Ceiling_Cat: yes, the halting problem.
2008-01-10 13:46 < Ceiling_Cat> TheWeasel - it always takes 100 years for advanced mathematics to become useful
2008-01-10 13:46 * Drunken_Idiot happy gives everyone a treat.
2008-01-10 13:46 < Cyrius> a universal turing machine cannot predict the halting of _any_ given UTM
2008-01-10 13:47 < Ceiling_Cat> (100 years on the low end)
2008-01-10 13:47 < Cyrius> you can answer the halting problem for certain useful subsets
2008-01-10 13:47 < quanticle> Tony_Sidaway: The halting problem and the decision problem are closely related. Both of them fail for the same reason: programs can loop infinitely
2008-01-10 13:47 < TheWeasel> yea
2008-01-10 13:47 < Ceiling_Cat> work figuring out effecient ways to factor large numbers which was done in the 1700s and 1800s is now finding uses in crytotology
2008-01-10 13:47 < zocky> US should adopt an imperial numbering system, where the last digit can have 12 values, one-before-last can have 8, two-before-last can have 11, etc.
2008-01-10 13:48 < quanticle> zocky: Multi-base numbering? Now there's a mindfuck
2008-01-10 13:48 < Tony_Sidaway> My father used to perform duodecimal calculations as a teenager when he worked as a clerk in an office. It was, he said, murderously boring.
2008-01-10 13:48 < Demi> zocky - that's a very funny use of "et cetera"
2008-01-10 13:49 < bumm13> see also: [[Peter Cetera]]
2008-01-10 13:49 < Tony_Sidaway> "et cetera" is simply an attempt to provoke any automatons reading this channel into executing an infinite loop.
2008-01-10 13:49 < zocky> demi, go with whatever is "logical", like 6, or 4, or 1760
2008-01-10 13:49 < Suva> I once went to a shop that had prices in hexadecimal :)
2008-01-10 13:50 < TheWeasel> Ceterum censeo...
2008-01-10 13:50 < Demi> sexagesimal is really the way to go
2008-01-10 13:50 < Demi> even metric incorporates it
2008-01-10 13:50 < Demi> because it's so awesome
2008-01-10 13:50 < Cyrius> bumm13: my dad's girlfriend's sister was married to peter cetera
2008-01-10 13:50 * bumm13 started the [[Sexagesimal]] article a long time ago
2008-01-10 13:51 < bumm13> Cyrius: o.o
2008-01-10 13:51 < zocky> peter cetera from the obscure 1970s band?
2008-01-10 13:51 < quanticle> Tony_Sidaway: However, all the places in duodecimal have the same base. Its not like what zocky proposed, where you have different bases for different places
2008-01-10 13:51 < bumm13> uh, Chicago?
2008-01-10 13:51 < Demi> Cyrius - did he got a new name at ellis island, like "therest"?
2008-01-10 13:51 < bumm13> not that obscure
2008-01-10 13:51 < Lycurgus> and started in the 60s
2008-01-10 13:51 < zocky> bumm13, yeah, I know it was very popular in US. it wasn't really "obscure" in europe, but it wasn't nearly as popular as in US
2008-01-10 13:52 < Drunken_Idiot> Lycurgus: ALoha.
2008-01-10 13:52 < Lycurgus> (originally named after the CTA IIRC). Hello DI.
2008-01-10 13:52 < bumm13> well, to be fair, they started sucking by about 1971 :P
2008-01-10 13:52 < bumm13> and especially into the 1980s
2008-01-10 13:52 < Cyrius> bumm13: her other sister married Robert Lamm
2008-01-10 13:52 < bumm13> their debut album is fantastic, though
2008-01-10 13:52 < Demi> zocky - because europeans don't know what a "chicago" is
2008-01-10 13:53 < Demi> they think it's some kind of whore tram
2008-01-10 13:53 < Rp2> what is a "chicago"?
2008-01-10 13:53 < Lycurgus> Falsch, ganz falsch.
2008-01-10 13:53 < bumm13> Cyrius: prog groupies? :x
2008-01-10 13:53 < quanticle> Demi: Perhaps they should have released under "London" in Europe
2008-01-10 13:53 < Demi> quanticle - more like Glasgow
2008-01-10 13:53 < quanticle> Demi: Or Liverpool
2008-01-10 13:53 < zocky> quanticle, wouldn't that be "manchester" or something?
2008-01-10 13:54 < Demi> yeah, maybe
2008-01-10 13:54 < quanticle> zocky: See above
2008-01-10 13:54 < bumm13> yeah, basically
2008-01-10 13:54 < Tony_Sidaway> whore tram? Why do I want to read that Fortran?
2008-01-10 13:54 < Demi> hehe
2008-01-10 13:54 < zocky> actually, the 3rd largest city in UK is Leeds
2008-01-10 13:54 < Demi> i'm actually thinking that Whore Tram would be a lot better name for a band than Chicago
2008-01-10 13:55 < winwinwin> any libraries to remove red eyes and make skin more smoother from photos?
2008-01-10 13:55 < Drunken_Idiot> !ping
2008-01-10 13:55 < Lycurgus> yeah but Chicago is traditionally the 2nd city
2008-01-10 13:55 < Demi> in what big city does the UK slaughter all its animals?
2008-01-10 13:55 < quanticle> zocky: Hmm, but does Leeds have the same "mood" as Chicago?
2008-01-10 13:55 < zocky> than birmingham
2008-01-10 13:55 < bumm13> Demi: Bay Area Rapid Transit wouldn't have much of a ring to it
2008-01-10 13:55 < zocky> quanticle, the only thing I know about leeds is that they have a football club
2008-01-10 13:55 < quanticle> winwinwin: I'm sure there are tutorials
2008-01-10 13:56 < Demi> winwinwin - you mean non-interactively? i haven't heard of anything like that
2008-01-10 13:56 < quanticle> Demi: ImageMagick?
2008-01-10 13:57 < zocky> "Acts from Leeds include The Wedding Present - who once had 12 new hit singles in the same calendar year, a feat unmatched by any other artist - Chumbawamba and Melanie B, of the Spice Girls."
2008-01-10 13:57 < zocky> that's nearly as good as chicago, no? :\
2008-01-10 13:57 < Demi> quanticle - what about it?
2008-01-10 13:57 < quanticle> Demi: ImageMagick is noninteractive
2008-01-10 13:57 < bumm13> zocky: that's horrible
2008-01-10 13:58 < bumm13> at least The Who had a notable concert there years ago :P
2008-01-10 13:58 < Demi> quanticle - afaik it does things like scaling and basic image processing, not "skin smoothing" or detecting eyes and recoloring them
2008-01-10 13:58 < Tony_Sidaway> Yep, imagemagick will do it all in batch for you
2008-01-10 13:58 < bumm13> that sounds more in the realm of Photoshop, maybe
2008-01-10 13:58 < Tony_Sidaway> Demi: I believe it's possible to do batch work in GIMP, too.
2008-01-10 13:58 < quanticle> bumm13: I'm pretty sure that The Who have had a notable concert in pretty much every big city in USA and Europe
2008-01-10 13:58 < Demi> convert --remove-redeyes --smooth-skin bad.jpg good.jpg? i can't see it
2008-01-10 13:59 < bumm13> quanticle: maybe, but this one was released as a live album
2008-01-10 13:59 < Tony_Sidaway> The Live in Leeds set went down in history, for some reason.
2008-01-10 13:59 < bumm13> (in 1970)
2008-01-10 13:59 < quanticle> Tony_Sidaway: Yeah, you can use script-fu or python-fu to script Gimp operations
2008-01-10 13:59 < Demi> Tony_Sidaway - i think so, but i would be surprised to find the kinds of functions he originally asked for.. it sounds like a hard problem to me
2008-01-10 13:59 < winwinwin> quanticle Demi yeah, automatic
2008-01-10 13:59 < Tony_Sidaway> They even had a rerun more recently. One staff member at the University union even remembered the first time.
2008-01-10 14:00 < Tony_Sidaway> Dunno if she threw her knickers on the stage the second time, though.
2008-01-10 14:00 < Demi> hehe
2008-01-10 14:00 < zocky> ok, soft cell and whitesnake are also from leeds
2008-01-10 14:00 < bumm13> a tad better
2008-01-10 14:00 < Tony_Sidaway> Demi: a soft focus filter and a red-eye filter, this isn't hard and I thnk it would be reasonable to expect to find them in Gimp.
2008-01-10 14:01 < Demi> right, that may be
2008-01-10 14:01 < bumm13> it sure took a long time for a music vehicle involving David Coverdale to gain any popularity
2008-01-10 14:01 < bumm13> (back in the mid 80s)
2008-01-10 14:02 < bumm13> he was in late-era Deep Purple clear back in 1974
2008-01-10 14:02 < Tony_Sidaway> I remember him when he was the replacement lead singer of Deep Purple.
2008-01-10 14:02 < Tony_Sidaway> Who had left? Ian Gillan?
2008-01-10 14:02 < bumm13> then formed "David Coverdale's Whitesnake" in 1978
2008-01-10 14:02 < Tony_Sidaway> as distinct from Adolph Hitler's Whitesnake.
2008-01-10 14:02 < bumm13> by the time it did happen, it was all shrouded in big hair and a car hood-writhing girlfriend :x
2008-01-10 14:02 < Demi> winwinwin - so if you can find a gimp filter or plugin that does what you want, i think it wouldn't be hard to have gimp do that in a batch
2008-01-10 14:03 < Demi> as Tony_Sidaway suggests
2008-01-10 14:03 < Tony_Sidaway> Or photoshop if you have it.
2008-01-10 14:04 < Demi> I've heard my wife complaining about Photoshop's redeye removal thing, which was late coming to it and I'm pretty sure still has you select the eyes
2008-01-10 14:04 < Demi> But then I don't necessarily listen to the details of my wife's complaints, so I may be mistaken
2008-01-10 14:05 < winwinwin> Demi no luck on this...
2008-01-10 14:05 < quanticle> winwinwin: There's a Gimp plugin for red-eye removal, but you have to select the eyes
2008-01-10 14:06 < winwinwin> quanticle thanks...
2008-01-10 14:06 < quanticle> winwinwin: Automatic eye recognition isn't nearly good enough to pull this off automatically
2008-01-10 14:06 < winwinwin> skin smoother is somehow a future tech
2008-01-10 14:07 * Demi virtually shaves everyone, removes moles and blemishes
2008-01-10 14:07 < Aqwis> i hear the blur tool is useful for making skin smooth ;)
2008-01-10 14:08 < Aqwis> 100px gaussian blur should be sufficient
2008-01-10 14:11 < Triona> Pretty advanced technique for it, from the link on our article http://forrestcroce.com/Articles/DigitalSoftFocus.html
2008-01-10 14:20 * Drunken_Idiot gone to bed.
2008-01-10 14:27 < mavhk> just find the 2 red dots, and see if you can find the head around them
2008-01-10 14:27 < Demi> mavhk - i look forward to your plugin
2008-01-10 14:28 < NotACow> DIVE DIVE
2008-01-10 14:29 < mavhk> it's probably built into cameras by now, they have face detection
2008-01-10 14:39 < Filanca`> hi!
2008-01-10 14:40 < Ceiling_Cat> hello Filanca`
2008-01-10 14:41 < Ceiling_Cat> Wegge - I already did it in photoshop, but I don't have access to the file right now (I'm at work)
2008-01-10 14:41 < Ceiling_Cat> doh
2008-01-10 14:44 < Ceiling_Cat> the way I did it was to open it up in acrobat
2008-01-10 14:44 < Ceiling_Cat> take screen shots
2008-01-10 14:46 < Filanca`> people are attacking vandals as usual :(
2008-01-10 14:47 < Triona> I'd love to see what happens if all vandalfighting stopped for a day.
2008-01-10 14:50 < nazgjunk> Triona, 3/4 of wikipedia would be bored
2008-01-10 14:50 < Tony_Sidaway> Triona: it's an interesting idea. Once, a few years ago on Usenet, the spam fighters decided to hold a demonstration. For one day they would down tools to demonstrate the usefulness of their work and to measure the raw spam output. They did that, but strangely the predicted glut of spam didn't happen. The spam rates increased a small amount. It was really surprising.
2008-01-10 14:52 < Triona> Tony_Sidaway: I think by that time, other spam control measures were in place too
2008-01-10 14:52 < Tony_Sidaway> I don't know whether a similar effect would be visible if all the dedicated vandal fighters stopped on Wikipedia. Perhaps other users would step in, perhaps not.
2008-01-10 14:53 < Triona> In our case, we can see that the rate of vandalism's pretty constant.
2008-01-10 14:53 < Demi> i think vandalism would change in nature over time
2008-01-10 14:53 < Demi> people who vandalize to get a rise out of people would lose interest
2008-01-10 14:54 < Tony_Sidaway> I may have become blind to vandalism, but I find that on my watchlist (which is usually pretty random and very, very large) vandalism is hardly noticeable.
2008-01-10 14:54 < Demi> i'm not sure you'd see that in a day, though
2008-01-10 14:54 < Suva> Vandalism sucks :P
2008-01-10 14:55 < Tony_Sidaway> I did use rollback once today, to remove some vandalism from a schools article.
2008-01-10 14:55 < Demi> do you think subway cars would have vandalism, or that it would be popular, if regular people could remove it just by touching it?
2008-01-10 14:55 < Tony_Sidaway> Schools articles do get a disproportionate amount of vandalism, I assume from bored pupils.
2008-01-10 14:55 < Triona> I barely even look at what I'm reverting now... there's so much vandalism it's hard to spend time on any one edit
2008-01-10 14:56 < Triona> ip edit, check, removed most of the article, check, inserted "fuck you", check - rollback
2008-01-10 14:56 < Tony_Sidaway> That's one thing I've seldom done--vandalism patrol. I find the very idea makes me think of making an early start on next year's tax return.
2008-01-10 14:56 < bumm13> heh
2008-01-10 14:56 < Triona> Whole of 2 seconds spent on any one vandal.
2008-01-10 14:57 < Triona> plus 15 more to warn them.
2008-01-10 14:57 < Triona> :/
2008-01-10 14:57 < Triona> We'd be better off if the vast majority were "warned" with a 24 hour block.
2008-01-10 14:57 < Demi> how about if no one bothered with warning or blocking for a week?
2008-01-10 14:58 < Triona> demi: then there'd be noone to escalate to, and you'd have to sit there following contribs and reverting
2008-01-10 14:58 < Tony_Sidaway> I do think the "oh let's go to Wikipedia and do some vandalism" thing has died down since 2004 when I first edited.
2008-01-10 14:58 < Triona> and it would suck
2008-01-10 14:58 < Demi> you wouldn't have to do anything, you never do
2008-01-10 14:58 < Triona> if someone's determined to vandalize, they keep going
2008-01-10 14:59 < Tony_Sidaway> We used to have these wannabe celebrity vandals like Wikipedia is Communism or that other block who did move vandalism, forgot his name.
2008-01-10 14:59 < Demi> what makes them "determined to vandalize?" i suspect that at least in some cases it's due to attention and the rise they get out of wikipedia
2008-01-10 14:59 < bumm13> Willy on Wheels!
2008-01-10 14:59 < Triona> case in point... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:216.100.93.127
2008-01-10 14:59 < Tony_Sidaway> There used to be these absolutely massive strikes, script-based. Suddenly hundreds of major articles would be moved.
2008-01-10 14:59 < Triona> Bored kids.
2008-01-10 15:00 < Tony_Sidaway> It doesn't happen so much now. We have better counter-measures, for one.
2008-01-10 15:00 < Triona> Our countermeasures require too much work.
2008-01-10 15:00 < Demi> no one ever answers my questions about the subway cars
2008-01-10 15:01 < Demi> subway cars are parked in locked yards with fences around them
2008-01-10 15:01 < Demi> but perimeters never work; they still get vandalized, sometimes extensively
2008-01-10 15:02 < bumm13> it's those darn graffiti gremlins
2008-01-10 15:02 < Triona> maintaining the status quo takes up so much work that it keeps a lot of editors from making constructive rather than protective edits
2008-01-10 15:02 < Demi> actual vandalism is countered best by cleaning it immediately, it seems, without worrying a whole lot about catching or punishing everyone; so i imagine a case where the vandalism countermeasure is simply to make it extremely easy to remove
2008-01-10 15:02 < Triona> rollback does that
2008-01-10 15:02 < Triona> it's not enough
2008-01-10 15:02 < Demi> well, a) it could be easier, and b) we've never tried that
2008-01-10 15:02 < Triona> if they haven't gotten bored after the 5th time, they aren't going to
2008-01-10 15:02 < Tony_Sidaway> Yes, if the vandal finds that he doesn't get recognition he gets bored and goes and pisses in a pond where he will make bigger ripples.
2008-01-10 15:02 < Demi> (i doubt we could, given the attitude people have toward wikipedia)
2008-01-10 15:03 < bumm13> in real life, everyone should have a vicious dog that is released when a camera sees movement and is interpreted by special AI as "graffiti vandalism"
2008-01-10 15:03 < Triona> I've tried before not warning someone
2008-01-10 15:03 < Triona> and just letting them vandalize and immediately cleaning up afterwards
2008-01-10 15:03 < Tony_Sidaway> I never bother warning.
2008-01-10 15:03 < Triona> they just keep going
2008-01-10 15:03 < Tony_Sidaway> They stop when you semiprotect.
2008-01-10 15:04 < Triona> if they bother to check the page after the initial vandalism, they'll keep going
2008-01-10 15:04 < Triona> only page protection or a block stops them
2008-01-10 15:05 < Demi> people will always take wikipedia personally, they'll always think of vandalism as some kind of personal affront; so they'll always think in terms of erecting a perimeter to "protect" it, and they'll always want to catch and punish someone for it to make themselves feel better
2008-01-10 15:05 < Demi> so i don't think an experiment of the kind i describe could ever actually be carried out
2008-01-10 15:05 < Tony_Sidaway> Not *all* people.
2008-01-10 15:05 < Demi> right
2008-01-10 15:05 < Triona> let's just shoot vandals on sight
2008-01-10 15:05 < Demi> when i say all (if i did) i just mean "a bunch"
2008-01-10 15:05 < Triona> with rocket launchers
2008-01-10 15:06 < Triona> end of problem ;P
2008-01-10 15:06 < NotACow> yay
2008-01-10 15:06 < Triona> hire hitmen to take out a few
2008-01-10 15:06 < Tony_Sidaway> I seem to recall editing right through the vandalism on the Dubya page, back in 2005 when it had about a dozen items of vandalism per day.
2008-01-10 15:06 < Triona> *giggles*
2008-01-10 15:06 < Tony_Sidaway> We just ignored it and let the vandal reverters (most of them just random readers, I recall) fix it.
2008-01-10 15:07 < Tony_Sidaway> Granted, it did get worse around late 2005 and semiprotection was probably appropriate then, when it was introduced in December 2005.
2008-01-10 15:08 < Triona> The autoreverters are great.
2008-01-10 15:08 < Triona> That helps.
2008-01-10 15:08 < Triona> Bots will never catch it all though
2008-01-10 15:08 < Demi> Tony_Sidaway - hundreds and hundreds of pages (at least) are semiprotected now
2008-01-10 15:09 * Demi &
2008-01-10 15:09 < Tony_Sidaway> A couple of years on, I think it was a success, though at the time it felt like a wrench to move from the "anybody can edit" principle.
2008-01-10 15:09 < Tony_Sidaway> At the same time, article starts by IPs were disabled.
2008-01-10 15:10 < Tony_Sidaway> We had, I recall, experienced a doubling of the editorship in the month of December, 2005, in the wake of the Seigenthaler scandal. Simply because Wikipedia suddenly impinged on many people's consciousnesses.
2008-01-10 15:11 < Tony_Sidaway> it's taken us a while to recover out bearings, but I think we're through it now.
2008-01-10 15:12 < Triona> I think "anyone can contribute" would be a more realistic vision than "anyone can edit".
2008-01-10 15:13 < Triona> if you added a "propose changes" tab to the articles
2008-01-10 15:14 < Triona> semiprotection would then become even less of an issue
2008-01-10 15:16 < Triona> branch/tag/merge functionality could be applied too
2008-01-10 15:24 < mavhk> the vandalisation of a train is more expensive for the vandal though, that's why they don't bother again if it's removed straight away
2008-01-10 15:26 < Messedrocker> my iPhone looks slick and sexy sitting in its charging dock
2008-01-10 15:26 < mavhk> wait 3 months until you drop it and it cracks
2008-01-10 15:27 * Ceiling_Cat huggles Messedrocker
2008-01-10 15:29 < Scott5114> Ceiling_Cat: I think your huggle either went unnoticed or was shunned :o
2008-01-10 15:29 < placebo_effect> iPhones are overrated
2008-01-10 15:29 < mavhk> placebo_effect: obviously, due to their high rating
2008-01-10 15:29 < placebo_effect> mp3 + phone == not needed
2008-01-10 15:30 < mavhk> you want to carry 8 gadgets?
2008-01-10 15:30 < placebo_effect> nope, just 2
2008-01-10 15:30 < mavhk> why not just 1?
2008-01-10 15:30 < placebo_effect> cause i rarleyuse my phone anyways
2008-01-10 15:30 < Ceiling_Cat> Scott5114 - sad but true
2008-01-10 15:30 < mavhk> can you buy a phone that doesn't play mp3s any more?
2008-01-10 15:31 < placebo_effect> no clue, but if i want music, ill get an iPod
2008-01-10 15:31 < mavhk> I rarely use the phone function of my handheld computer
2008-01-10 15:31 < placebo_effect> or an iPod Touch
2008-01-10 15:31 < Scott5114> it's cheaper to get a free phone from a provider and an iPod
2008-01-10 15:31 < placebo_effect> i dont need a mp3 player with a phone
2008-01-10 15:31 < mavhk> why would you want to carry 2 devices when 1 will do?
2008-01-10 15:31 < Scott5114> mavhk: Because I'm a poor college student. That's why.
2008-01-10 15:31 < placebo_effect> cause i put my soul in my phone
2008-01-10 15:32 < mavhk> plus you have to pause the mp3 manually when the phone rings
2008-01-10 15:32 < mavhk> Scott5114: every phone plays mp3s
2008-01-10 15:32 < placebo_effect> its not hard to stop it
2008-01-10 15:32 < Scott5114> Not the one I have
2008-01-10 15:32 < placebo_effect> i just press the pause button
2008-01-10 15:32 < placebo_effect> on my radio remote
2008-01-10 15:32 < mavhk> every phone that costs more than $30
2008-01-10 15:32 < Scott5114> and usually if I'm not out and about I just have amarok play it
2008-01-10 15:33 < placebo_effect> phone + iPod Touch < iPhone
2008-01-10 15:33 < placebo_effect> costwise
2008-01-10 15:33 < mavhk> phone that plays mp3s < phone + ipod
2008-01-10 15:34 < placebo_effect> nah
2008-01-10 15:34 < Scott5114> besides, all of the cheap iPhone knockoffs are starting to drag the price down
2008-01-10 15:34 < mavhk> the price has changed?
2008-01-10 15:34 < Scott5114> since it came out, I think so
2008-01-10 15:35 < mavhk> well yes, but that was before the cheap knockoffs
2008-01-10 15:35 < Scott5114> if it hasn't changed yet, it definitely will in the future
2008-01-10 15:36 < mavhk> based on your past knowledge of the matter we'll disregard your predictions
2008-01-10 15:37 < Scott5114> Who's we?
2008-01-10 15:37 < Scott5114> and what exactly is my past knowledge?
2008-01-10 15:37 < Messedrocker> mavhk, and what's worse is that my iPhone warranty is void :O
2008-01-10 15:37 < mavhk> <Scott5114> besides, all of the cheap iPhone knockoffs are starting to drag the price down
2008-01-10 15:37 < mavhk> Messedrocker: I'd buy some kind of foam spray that you spray whereever you're walking, just in case
2008-01-10 15:38 < Scott5114> well, I don't really pay much attention, but the price has gone down since the beginning
2008-01-10 15:38 < Messedrocker> yeah, it used to be $599
2008-01-10 15:38 < Messedrocker> now it's much less
2008-01-10 15:38 < Scott5114> and there are cheap knockoffs
2008-01-10 15:38 < Scott5114> there's probably at least *some* correlation
2008-01-10 15:38 < mavhk> cause comes before effect though
2008-01-10 15:38 < mavhk> hence the name
2008-01-10 15:39 < Scott5114> Apple most likely got wind of the competitors' products before they were released, though.
2008-01-10 15:39 < mavhk> $399 was always the price, steve just made it $599 to screw the fans
2008-01-10 15:41 < Scott5114> the only way I'll ever be able to have an iPhone is if I win one on The Price is Right or something. :P
2008-01-10 15:42 < Messedrocker> too easy
2008-01-10 15:42 < Messedrocker> "I guess this phone costs... $399?"
2008-01-10 15:42 < mavhk> without the phone tarrif it's cheaper than other smartphones/pda that are similar
2008-01-10 15:42 < Messedrocker> "I guess it costs $399.01"
2008-01-10 15:42 < Messedrocker> "You're the closest without going over"
2008-01-10 15:42 < ST47> DEATH TO FAIR USE
2008-01-10 15:43 < NotACow> DEATH TO DEATH
2008-01-10 15:43 < Scott5114> Messedrocker: Drew won't let you bid cents unfortunately.
2008-01-10 15:43 * Krator uses ST47 fairly
2008-01-10 15:43 < mavhk> we should upload copyrighted material to work on, but only let it be viewed by the editors until the copyright expires, don't publish it
2008-01-10 15:44 < NotACow> mavhk: i've suggested a similar handling for biographies of living people
2008-01-10 15:44 < Messedrocker> oh that's right, drew carrey hosts the show now
2008-01-10 15:44 < Messedrocker> i remember when he was announced as the new host
2008-01-10 15:44 < Messedrocker> i thought
2008-01-10 15:44 < NotACow> mavhk: ahve an unpublished draft that can only be published once the subject is deceased
2008-01-10 15:44 < Messedrocker> that's such an appropriate role for him!
2008-01-10 15:45 < Scott5114> and usually they use iPhones as part of a prize package, like a Showcase or they'll offer two or something (admittedly, easy, but could you multiply quickly in contestants row?).
2008-01-10 15:45 < placebo_effect> no one can replace Bob Barker
2008-01-10 15:45 < Scott5114> yeah, he's doing really well
2008-01-10 15:45 < Messedrocker> NotACow, good in theory, except what happens when "Sorry to hear about his death; let's unleash this (potentially slanderous) article out unto the world"
2008-01-10 15:45 < Scott5114> yeah, there's something about Bob
2008-01-10 15:45 < Scott5114> but Drew's pretty good
2008-01-10 15:45 < Scott5114> he's not better or worse...just...different is all
2008-01-10 15:48 < Scott5114> he likes to make jokes when they offer an illogical pairing of items.
2008-01-10 15:48 < Scott5114> e.g. inner tubes with a supply of tomato juice.
2008-01-10 15:48 < mavhk> I'm confused, people who can use the internet also watch gameshows?
2008-01-10 15:48 * Weaselosaurus comes in without a stupid quote from a Wikipedia article
2008-01-10 15:49 < Weaselosaurus> That's a firt.
2008-01-10 15:49 < Weaselosaurus> *firth
2008-01-10 15:49 < Weaselosaurus> :-P
2008-01-10 15:49 < Messedrocker> mavhk, it's the other way around
2008-01-10 15:49 < Messedrocker> or rather, the other way around who can't
2008-01-10 15:50 < Scott5114> people who take pictures of roadsigns also use the internet
2008-01-10 15:50 < Scott5114> oh, and people who write encyclopedias.
2008-01-10 15:51 < boggies> hey.
2008-01-10 15:52 < morwen> I belong to an internet project which involves many people taking pictures of roadsigns
2008-01-10 15:52 < mavhk> yeah, but they're not so old they can't remember how to change the channel/turn off the tv
2008-01-10 15:52 < boggies> if a user from a Wikipedia translates a large article from a foreign copyrighted encyclopedia, what is the solution?
2008-01-10 15:52 < morwen> extreme banninatation
2008-01-10 15:52 < Mahlzahn> boggies: {{db-copyvio}}
2008-01-10 15:52 < Messedrocker> boggies, the translation is a deriv of the original
2008-01-10 15:52 < boggies> I mean, something like Holocaust on Romanian wikipedia is based on the article from Encarta.
2008-01-10 15:53 < Messedrocker> so whatever the copyright on the original is...
2008-01-10 15:53 < NotACow> DEATH TO ENCARTA!
2008-01-10 15:53 < boggies> Messedrocker: how much do I bet that that the ro.wiki admins would rather ban me? :D
2008-01-10 15:53 < boggies> Messedrocker: I almost got banned when I said on their village pump that an admin is copyvio creating articles
2008-01-10 15:53 < NotACow> if they're like most slavic language admins, they'll ban you for not being One Of Them
2008-01-10 15:54 < boggies> *creating copyvio articles
2008-01-10 15:54 < boggies> NotACow: the admins were arguing I'm disrupting the community.
2008-01-10 15:54 < NotACow> my experience is that most of the slavic language projects are run more or less like armed camps, with the admins as jackbooted dictators.
2008-01-10 15:54 < boggies> NotACow: Romanians are not Slavic, but we're Eastern Europeans :-P
2008-01-10 15:55 < NotACow> boggies: ok, fine, eastern european native languages ten :)
2008-01-10 15:55 < Mahlzahn> boggies: {{azonnali|reason for speed delete}}
2008-01-10 15:55 < NotACow> boggies: the same s somewhat true of plwiki as well
2008-01-10 15:55 < NotACow> damn crazies
2008-01-10 15:55 < morwen> boggies: prepare your evidence, and take it to meta and foundation if you must
2008-01-10 15:55 < NotACow> too much unbridled nationaism
2008-01-10 15:56 < NotACow> if your country really were that great, it could deal with someone who said it wasn't.
2008-01-10 15:56 < boggies> NotACow: I know. you don't know what I had to endure to remove fascist propaganda :D
2008-01-10 15:56 < boggies> NotACow: I was banned twice.
2008-01-10 15:57 < Mahlzahn> boggies: for a case like that prepare an argument and forward to the foundation. That sort of stuff can cause the foundation to lose its non-profit status.
2008-01-10 15:57 < boggies> the second time for "disturbing wikipedia activity and harassing users" (telling the village pump that an admin is creating copyvio articles = harrassment)
2008-01-10 15:57 < Mahlzahn> and they take it very seriously.
2008-01-10 15:59 < Messedrocker> <NotACow> my experience is that most of the slavic language projects are run more or less like armed camps, with the admins as jackbooted dictators. << sounds like real-life slavic language regions
2008-01-10 16:00 < Weaselosaurus> Not the Czech Republic when I last went.
2008-01-10 16:00 < Weaselosaurus> Czechmate!
2008-01-10 16:02 < Aqwis> "The final results showed Ron Paul with 0 votes in Sutton. The next day a Ron Paul supporter came forward claiming that both she and several of her family members had voted for Ron Paul in Sutton."
2008-01-10 16:02 < Aqwis> awww
2008-01-10 16:02 < boggies> Messedrocker: maybe with the exception of Czech Republic . they're quite 22
2008-01-10 16:02 < NotACow> Aqwis: which proves that ron paul supporters either (a) cannot operate a voting device or (b) hallucinate while voting
2008-01-10 16:03 < boggies> the only sane country in the region.
2008-01-10 16:03 < Aqwis> eheh
2008-01-10 16:03 < NotACow> Aqwis: either is credible.
2008-01-10 16:03 < Weaselosaurus> Slovakia, Slovenia...
2008-01-10 16:03 < NotACow> slobodenia
2008-01-10 16:03 < boggies> Weaselosaurus: Slovenia, maybe, Slovakia, no.
2008-01-10 16:03 < Weaselosaurus> How so?
2008-01-10 16:04 < mavhk> patriotism is for people with no acheivements for themselves
2008-01-10 16:04 < NotACow> everyone needs something to be proud of
2008-01-10 16:04 < boggies> Weaselosaurus: they have a lot of nationalists :/
2008-01-10 16:04 < boggies> Weaselosaurus: extremists.
2008-01-10 16:04 < Weaselosaurus> yea, I thought official handling of affairs was meant
2008-01-10 16:05 < mavhk> as everyone knows, my country is best because I was born there
2008-01-10 16:06 < Weaselosaurus> Well, the American rationale is that the conditions for founding the country was so special, it still builds on that
2008-01-10 16:07 < Weaselosaurus> if I understand it right
2008-01-10 16:07 < Weaselosaurus> therefore "greatest country in the world" = "first to be founded on the idea of personal liberty"
2008-01-10 16:08 < Scott5114> Eh, I don't think the US is the greatest anymore.
2008-01-10 16:08 < Scott5114> Too many kooky laws.
2008-01-10 16:08 < Aqwis> iceland is the best country, so says the UN ;|
2008-01-10 16:08 < boggies> Aqwis: Iceland is cold and boring.
2008-01-10 16:09 < Weaselosaurus> I was making that point earlier
2008-01-10 16:09 < Scott5114> Iceland, huh?
2008-01-10 16:09 < FoeNyx> hmm cookie laws .. USA are probably the best then >.>
2008-01-10 16:09 < Weaselosaurus> it depends on how "goodness" is defined
2008-01-10 16:09 < boggies> Weaselosaurus: long, healthy life, well educated, high incomes.
2008-01-10 16:09 < Aqwis> norway is on second place
2008-01-10 16:09 < Aqwis> we're cold, but not boring tbh
2008-01-10 16:09 < Weaselosaurus> Bad weather.
2008-01-10 16:09 < Weaselosaurus> We've dropped a bit because of new and previously unheard of inequities
2008-01-10 16:10 < Weaselosaurus> in economic situation
2008-01-10 16:10 < Demi> "best" is kind of a silly concept for a country
2008-01-10 16:10 < Scott5114> part of the problem with the US is that Congress is essentially run by PACs and corporations.
2008-01-10 16:10 < Weaselosaurus> We're something like thirteenth now
2008-01-10 16:10 < Demi> that was a drive-by: discuss!